Help :( Shifting Problems...

Hlgreear · May 1, 2006

Hi Everyone,

I am having issues and I am at quiet a loss as to what the problem could be. This is my first truck and these are all new problems for me. The truck had a new clutch put in it before I got it so I am hoping it is not the problem. Yesterday, it was driving fine and suddenly it became very hard to shift. Its hard to place it in any gear. I have to two hand pull on the stick to get it into first gear and sometimes I have to turn the truck off and put in first then start and go. I have messed around with the zbar linkage, the one that has a long nut and bolt and I can not turn the nut out any further. Is there something in particular that would cause such a random problem? There is plenty of tranny grease. Is this a problem caused by a pressure plate? Additionally, if it is of any relevance, if I engage the clutch and hold it and get the truck in reverse, the truck will move backwards despite the fact the clutch is engaged. This has never happened before. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

-Howard

mmmikkke · May 1, 2006

Your clutch is not fully disengaging. This in turn is making the synchros work overtime as they are trying to get the gears spinning at the same speed despite the clutch not disengaging. The force you are applying as you struggle to get it in gear is being felt by the synchros.

You'll wear out your synchros if you don't fix the clutch quick.

ChevyTech007 · May 1, 2006

mmmikkke is absolutly correct. BTW, what year,engine, trans and model?

Hlgreear · May 2, 2006

Thanks for the replies Guys

Sorry, my truck is a '79 Chevy Scottsdale 1/2 ton 4x4. The tranny is a 4 speed(not sure model number) It has L(top left pattern),1,2,3,R and motor is 350 SB

In reply to mmmikkke reply, does this mean I need to drop my drivetrain and replace clutch? What is the direct cause do you think of the clutch not disengaging? Thanks again.

-Howard

btw, Image of truck is now below ;)

Hlgreear · May 2, 2006

..."Dragging clutch is the least common symptom and is just the opposite of slippage. Drag occurs when the clutch doesn't release at all, or releases only partially. Clutch drag is usually caused by a worn, binding or misadjusted clutch linkage. Drag can also be caused by air in the hydraulic clutch linkage, damaged pressure plate fingers, and binding of the clutch disc on the input shaft..."

I did some googling and this sounds like what you explained, I think. Could this be right, maybe all I need to do is align the clutch? But because the problem happened so fast, I doubt it could be this...But I am newb at this

-Howard

mmmikkke · May 2, 2006

Since it's intermittent, it could be a damaged pressure plate finger, or a defective (or not-replaced-with-the-clutch) pilot bearing.

I don't think there's an alignment provision outright, but if half of the bolts that hold the trans to the engine/bell housing are missing, yeah, that could lead to mislignment.

Sounds like I'd open it up and take a look.

Hlgreear · May 4, 2006

Yeah, I am going to pull it apart in a few days. I am not looking forward to it because the Tranny and Transfer Case are so high off the ground If I rent a tranny jack will that be beneficial as far as time is concerned. I will have access to two heavy duty floor jacks, so I think that should be enough. Do I really need to unbolt the transfer case from the Tranny? Or can I leave them together and drop as one to avoid changing the gasket? The truck got worse tot he point that I cannot drive it at all ;( I can have it in first and engage clutch and let off gas and it will still do compression braking...Can the spline get stuck? Anyways, this is my first time doing this type of work on a 4x4 so it should be a learning experience and I should make it as fun as possible ha, like that will happen...Take it easy guys.

-Howard

Draenor · May 4, 2006

You can leave the tranny and t-case together, but youll have to deal with the weight. Sounds like the throw out bearing or clutch pressure plate is bad. Also On a lifted truck...letting the air out the tires helps on the height issue.

Hlgreear · May 4, 2006

Nice, yeah I will def. let air out then Any bit will help no doubt. How will I know if the throw out bearing or pressure plate is bad? Will it be obvious which is the problem? Can I buy just that individual part? Thanks for your help guys ;)

-Howard

bobcat5544 · May 4, 2006

Hi Everyone,

I am having issues and I am at quiet a loss as to what the problem could be. This is my first truck and these are all new problems for me. The truck had a new clutch put in it before I got it so I am hoping it is not the problem. Yesterday, it was driving fine and suddenly it became very hard to shift. Its hard to place it in any gear. I have to two hand pull on the stick to get it into first gear and sometimes I have to turn the truck off and put in first then start and go. I have messed around with the zbar linkage, the one that has a long nut and bolt and I can not turn the nut out any further. Is there something in particular that would cause such a random problem? There is plenty of tranny grease. Is this a problem caused by a pressure plate? Additionally, if it is of any relevance, if I engage the clutch and hold it and get the truck in reverse, the truck will move backwards despite the fact the clutch is engaged. This has never happened before. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

-Howard

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hold On Here

You stated you have to turn the veh off just to get it into 1st gear

With the veh not running can you shift into gears with little force? If you can then it IS NOT AN INTERNAL TRANS PROB....

Is the clutch master cylinder full on fluid? If not look around the master cylinder for leaks, look around the Trans bell house for fluid leak if there is no leaks then the Clutch master cylinder has internal seal failed...

If the pressure plate, or throw out bearing had a problem then you would here a noise or the clutch would be slipping

Hlgreear · May 4, 2006

Yeah, when the vehicle is OFF I can change gears with ease, no force required. However when I start the truck in neutral I cannot shift gears to easily. I have to place two hands on the stick and literally pull with all my strength and it will pop in very hard. So when I approach a stop, I cannot shift the truck back in first so I turn it off and place in first and start and go. However, I can downshift without using the clutch pedal and it is a little easier.

If I leave my truck in first and drive around and say I was coming to a stop sign, If i engage the clutch pedal and let off gas as to coast to stop, the truck still does compression braking despite facts pedal is pushed. If I am sitting at sitting at stop sign for a prolonged period of time, the truck will act as if it wants to die. The clutch NEVER slips when I am in gear.

The truck has made NO noises whatsoever since the problem happened, It just started happening randomly, was working fine and then it went to this. As I stated, the clutch setup is all new, clutch plate, pressure plate, throw out bearing, etc. I replaced some of the mechanical pedal parts the other day and still nothing. I will take pictures of my setup under the truck to give you guys a better idea. I REALLY appreciate you guys

Also, does my truck have a master cylinder? It is 79 Chevy truck and it has mechanical linkages. What does this slave cylinder look like?

helping me.

-Howard

Hlgreear · May 4, 2006

Here are some links to my Transmission.

Where transmission meets bellhousing

Tranny Mounts

Bellhousing and oil Filter

The new linkage that I installed

The transmission

My Truck

bobcat5544 · May 4, 2006

Yeah, when the vehicle is OFF I can change gears with ease, no force required. However when I start the truck in neutral I cannot shift gears to easily. I have to place two hands on the stick and literally pull with all my strength and it will pop in very hard. So when I approach a stop, I cannot shift the truck back in first so I turn it off and place in first and start and go. However, I can downshift without using the clutch pedal and it is a little easier.

If I leave my truck in first and drive around and say I was coming to a stop sign, If i engage the clutch pedal and let off gas as to coast to stop, the truck still does compression braking despite facts pedal is pushed. If I am sitting at sitting at stop sign for a prolonged period of time, the truck will act as if it wants to die. The clutch NEVER slips when I am in gear.

The truck has made NO noises whatsoever since the problem happened, It just started happening randomly, was working fine and then it went to this. As I stated, the clutch setup is all new, clutch plate, pressure plate, throw out bearing, etc. I replaced some of the mechanical pedal parts the other day and still nothing. I will take pictures of my setup under the truck to give you guys a better idea. I REALLY appreciate you guys

Also, does my truck have a master cylinder? It is 79 Chevy truck and it has mechanical linkages. What does this slave cylinder look like?

helping me.

-Howard

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

take pic let me see you set up. that year could have either mech or hydr clutch, but if it is linkage, then where the linkage connects to the throw out fork may need to be adjusted

also when you tightened the bolts down on the pressure plate what did you torque them to

Hlgreear · May 4, 2006

The pics are right above your post bobcat5544 same time posting.

The new clutch was installed right before I acquired truck from my friend. I will get info about Torque specs.

MemphisDoug · May 5, 2006

I think your clutch linkage is just not adjusted right. If you push down on your clutch pedal with your hand, do you have a lot of measurable freeplay before you start to feel anything happen. My guess is that the pedal is probably going almost to the floor before you start to feel any resistance.

Your clutch will not slip in the condition it is in because it is never disengaging. That is also why you are feeling engine braking in 1st gear even though the pedal is pushed down.

Looking at your pictures, it looks as though the adjusting nut on your linkage is screwed all the way out to the end of the linkage. That will need to be tightened. There should actually be 2 nuts that can be tightened together so they lock and don't spin. I think you want about an inch or so of free play in the pedal as you push it down before you feel resistance.

Try adjusting your linkage before taking your transmission out! Have someone sit in the truck and push the clutch pedal while you watch underneath and make sure everything is moving correctly. I was looking at the picture of your linkage again and it almost looks like one end of it is dangling in the air between those 2 springs. Is the linkage even pushing against the throw out fork?