Manual Transmission?

kansaskeith2004 · December 9, 2004

ok, i got a 2004 chevy regular cab with the 4.8L V8 and the NV3500 manual 5 speed transmission. The only problem is that the tranny is only rated to like 285 torque which is what the factory says the engine is supposed to be at now. So i want to either get the NV4500 and swap it or the 6 speed that comes in the bigger trucks if this is possible. I will probably still keep the 4.8, unless i could get a good deal on motor and trans. Thanks

03Bluerado · December 11, 2004

Congrats on buying a real truck (reg. cab) and a real trans (manual).

Dont worry about swapping out the trans, I have a 4.8 and the nv3500....yes they have a low rating but they will hold up fine, they have been around for a long time.

I think yours is actually made in Japan now, I think 03 was the last year they were built by new venture in muncie, after that GM was able to get them built in Japan for a lil less...I am sure they are just as good if not better.

When i was researching my 03 purchase I spoke to someone who worked at new venture/new process in Indiana, I think he may be on the pickuptruck.com board...anyways he said they would beat the holy living hell out of these things at thier test facility, constantly dumping the clutch, banging gears and they held up fine.

I have 40k on my 03 and have towed quite a bit, wheeled the truck and its fine. Take care of it, change out the synchomesh after you put a 1k on it, then again at 30k and just drive it...its a decent trans!

The 4500 and 6 speed are different animals...for one the 4500 is not aluminum...much heavier and it has a granny gear...

Good luck--enjoy!

ok, i got a 2004 chevy regular cab with the 4.8L V8 and the NV3500 manual 5 speed transmission. The only problem is that the tranny is only rated to like 285 torque which is what the factory says the engine is supposed to be at now. So i want to either get the NV4500 and swap it or the 6 speed that comes in the bigger trucks if this is possible. I will probably still keep the 4.8, unless i could get a good deal on motor and trans. Thanks

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jankemi · December 12, 2004

ok, i got a 2004 chevy regular cab with the 4.8L V8 and the NV3500 manual 5 speed transmission.

How much are you towing?

(I agree with Bluerado. Real truck. Don't worry about the tranny.)

Mike

(01 4.8 5spd LWLB 4wd)

NV5600 · December 12, 2004

I don't think that I'm the NVG guy referred to in this topic but I do work there at this time. I build the NV5600 6-speed manual. Right now, their input shaft and clutch housings are designed to work with Dodge Ram trucks. Keep in mind that this transmission weighs 365# wet. It's physical size is similar to a small L6 engine. There were a few prototypes built for GM applications but nothing has come of it as of yet. GM should've used this transmission. We don't build them on a conventional assembly line. They are literally hand-built with no robotics involved whatsoever. I do final assembly.

The NV4500 is also still being built in Muncie as is the NV3500. The NV1500 line was discontinued and replaced by the Japanese company Aisin for use in the Colorado/Canyon trucks. The 3500 line will be shutting down soon within the next few months. I'm not sure about the 4500 but it is leaving as well. The 5600 is leaving in January thus my job with GM in Muncie along with about 900 other men and women will be gone. Most of us will transfer to other GM plants.

03Bluerado · December 12, 2004

I don't think that I'm the NVG guy referred to in this topic but I do work there at this time.

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Hey NV5600....I think it was you I was refering too!!! Randy right??

I thought you mentioned to me that the 3500 was going to be built in Japan, after 03...its been awhile now so I forget...I remember you telling me that the NV3500's were pretty tuff trannies!!

Well I have been really happy with my 03 with the 4.8 and the NV3500. When I first got the truck at the end of Dec. 02 I was a little concerned that the trans made some noise when you would put a load on it in 3rd and 4th at anything under 2k rpm. By sheer luck the dealer had a base model with a 4.8 and NV3500 a few weeks after I bought mine, I drove it with the service manager and it also made the same noise, he said I was lugging it...I dont know about that, I know what serious lugging is, and this wasnt it! Anyways, the truck still does it but I dont drive it in a manner that really makes it noticeable.

To keep it above 2k rpm after a shift would require shifting the truck at 3k rpm...a bit much in most cases and a killer for mileage! Well after 40K the trans is fine, I have changed out the fluid twice and am pretty easy on it. Only thing that worries me is the small clutch, I try to take it easy and keep the weight down when I tow.

Sorry to hear you guys are losing your jobs building the trans...thats a d**n shame....I'm sure your talent will will keep you employed for a long time though...

Anyways, one last question for you NV, as the 3500 is supposedly rated to 285lbs torque, but now for 05 GM has upped the power, can this trans really hold up to quite a bit more than its rated capacity? I think I remember you telling me that it would be fine under more power...now that I think of it I remember a dealer selling 4.8 5 speed silverados with a supercharger...I think it was Joe Gibbs.

Glad to see your still around and your 05 in your sig. looks awesome!!

NV5600 · December 12, 2004

It's good to hear from you again '03. Officially, I can't tell you that the NV3500 will take the torque of an '05. Really, I was surprised at the low torque ratiing myself. I haven't heard any test comments. While it's not my department, I do believe that they send some NV3500s to Ft. Wayne at this time. Sorry if I gave confusing info about the Japan thing.

We're now solely a GM Powertrain plant and not a joint venture with Daimler/Chrysler anymore. You might try here: http://media.gm.com/division/2005_prodinfo...issions/mg5.htm or go to http://www.gm.com/automotive/gmpowertrain/...other/index.htm to learn more about GM Powertrain manual transmissions.

Oh, and not to hijack the thread but thanks for the well-wishes '03Bluerado. They've built manual trannies here for over 50 years. It's a darned shame and a sign of the times.

03Bluerado · December 12, 2004

Hey thanks for the update!! I am a little confused though...you mention some of the 3500's go to Ft. Wayne, that is where my truck was built, and I guess the plant where they build the regular cab 1500's so that makes since....but if they are shutting down operations where you work does that mean we will soon see the demise of the manual transmission in GM trucks alltogether?? I surely hope not, but from the way things have been going that seems like it, sad..

Oh yeah, you have any insight on why the 3500 makes a little noise with a load on it at low rpm...is it bad for it? I am not really worried about it, just kinda curious!

Thanks!!!

NV5600 · December 13, 2004

I don't think that it spells the demise of the manual transmission. There is more of a market for them than I thought that there would be. My guess is that somewhere there is a plant already tooled up and ready to start producing our products. They're very tight-lipped about where our work is going to. We have some ideas but I won't speculate and start rumors here.

Now as for your noise, again, I build 5600s but I will take a stab at your noise situation since some processes are similar. Transmissions are tested in a quiet room/test stand. A person sits in a truck seat and shifts every one of them. They're hooked up to an electric motor and a load applied to the output shaft. They have to be quiet and pass "drag torque" tests in order to be passed. Drag torque is the amount of torque required to turn the input and output shafts. They don't put the kind of load that you put on it at low RPM and high gear though.

Gear geometry is fascinating. The gear tooth has 4 main parameters that need to be met. They are lead, involute, helix and pitch diameter. All of your gears are in constant mesh all of the time. Speed gears are engaged by the shifter moving a shift rail which is pinned to a fork which rides in a groove in a hub/sleeve assembly. The hubs are pressed onto the counteshaft and mainshaft. The sleeve is grooved to fit over both the hub and the clutch teeth on the gears on either side of it. Shifting is accomplished by merely sliding the sleeve which is grooved to fit over the pressed-on hub, over the clutch teeth of the desired gear. A grinding sound when you miss a gear is actually the gear clutch tooth grinding agains the sleeve.

The odd thing about your noise is that I believe that 4th gear is direct drive on the 3500 or in other words, the input shaft/drive gear is the 4th speed. Now, I am not positive about that. I know that is how it is in the 4500. The 5600 has an actual 4th speed gear in it. Each gear has a drive side and a coast side of the tooth. You might try creating the noise as you usually do then let off the gas and let it come down on the coast side of the tooth. My feeling is that it isn't a serious problem but rather a situation where mating gears have slightly different tooth geometries. It could even be a resonance that sets up betweend the engine>clutch>gear rotating assembly that is somehow being amplified.

There is a guy in our department now who used to build 3500s. I'll run it by him or stop one of the engineers and ask him. Like I said, don't take my word on it!

Sorry for writing a book but it might help everyone visualize what is going on.

dr9672723 · December 13, 2004

I can't help but wonder if the noise you are hearing is just the power pulsations from the engine at low RPMs. If you've ever had a 6 cylinder truck and "lugged" it a bit in high gear, you will especially hear the whole driveline vibrate, since a 6 cyl has 3 power strokes per revolution vs. 4 for a V8. ???????? If that's it, I wouldn't worry about it.