5w30 oil

Grumpy Bear · August 21

5W30. This is just a list of those oils with a HTHS of 3.5 or greater. Most use even more VII and meet the minimum 2.9 HTHS value. Let's put some 0W20 in our EcoTec3's? HTFS is a head turner. :crackup: BITOG is good for something once in a while.

Gangly · August 21

Guys, this information is great, but the use of a gajillion acronyms is KILLING ME since I have no clue what the acronyms are short for. Can somebody please make a list so that I know what I am looking at?

HTHS
VII

BITOG
etc....

Grumpy Bear · August 21

2 minutes ago, Gangly said:

Guys, this information is great, but the use of a gajillion acronyms is KILLING ME since I have no clue what the acronyms are short for. Can somebody please make a list so that I know what I am looking at?

HTHS
VII

BITOG
etc....

Yes sir:

HTHS = Viscosity in centipoise under the conditions of High Temperature and High Shear

VII = Viscosity Index Improver. A very large molecule used to limit viscosity loss due to heat.

BITOG= Bob is the Oil Guy. A forum that talks about nothing but lubrication.

Which others do you need?

Gangly · August 21

20 minutes ago, Grumpy Bear said:

Yes sir:

HTHS = Viscosity in centipoise under the conditions of High Temperature and High Shear

VII = Viscosity Index Improver. A very large molecule used to limit viscosity loss due to heat.

BITOG= Bob is the Oil Guy. A forum that talks about nothing but lubrication.

Which others do you need?

Since you asked

POA

POE

SAPS

VOA

TAN

TBN

HPL

HVHI

And thanks for your breakdown above. The acronym, combined with the short desciption of each that you provided, was very helpful.

Edited August 21 by Gangly

diyer2 · August 21

As you all know I have been an advocate of shorter OCI's, unless you upgrade your oil from off the shelf oil. My thinking was back in the day when motors were carbureted they were a lot simpler mechanically. As I owned newer vehicles doing the maintenance it was evident to me the oil was taking a beating, even though oil technology was advancing. As you know I'm also big on checking my oil regularly.

My guide was how dirty the oil got vs the mileage on it, a simple guideline.

This guideline of dirty oil started for me in the 70's during the muscle car era. I was racing 1/4 mile on the weekends with a daily driver. I always changed my oil and filter before racing no matter the miles on it and after racing due to the abuse the oil took. I drove the car to the track on the freeway and back home and with the big gears it ran at high rpms and then racing was hard use.

Like I have said before I like clean oil and oil is cheap in my book. No other vehicle fluid is subjected to the abuse a motor puts on motor oil, it's a tough environment.

I now use Amsoil products that I would not pay for before. It has been worth the cost to me, my motors are quieter and the transmissions shift better using their OE line of fluids.

Grumpy Bear · August 21

1 hour ago, Gangly said:

Since you asked

POA

POE

SAPS

VOA

TAN

TBN

HPL

HVHI

And thanks for your breakdown above. The acronym, combined with the short desciption of each that you provided, was very helpful.

POA Poly Alpha Olefin. A base oil synthetic. More uniform in molecule size and species. Greater heat tolerance. Less polar, which means less solvency. Only Group IV fluid there is.

POE A group of NPG based esters. Neopentyl Glycol. The alcohol used to synthesize bean oils to Group V fluids. One of many Group V's. VERY high heat tolerance. High Solvency. High Lubricity. Expesive and used more often as a modifier base oil than a stand alone.

SAPS Sulfonated Ash/Phosphorous/Sulphur content.

VOA Virgin Oil Analysis

HPL High Performance Lubricants. A boutique oil blender.

HVHI. Did you mean HVI? High viscosity index hydraulic oil.

TAN Acid Number Some is present in new oil and that varies with chemistry. Too much is bad

TBN Base Number A number that attempts to define the acid neutralization power of the chemistry. It falls in use as those additives get used. They are sacrificial

HPL High Performance Lubricants. A boutique blender. Company name

HVHI? Did you mean HVI High viscosity index hydraulic oil.

Others

VM's Viscosity modifiers. VII is one PPD is another

PPD Pour Point depressant. Additive used on paraffin containing oils.

Silverado4x4 · August 21

:lurk:

Edited August 21 by Silverado4x4

Grumpy Bear · August 21

In a perfect world a machine would never ever wear out. The lubricant would prevent any possible contact between surfaces. It is its main job. Prevent parts from touching other parts. And the lubricant would never wear out. (Think air bearings).

IF that were true, and it cannot be; one car per family would last infinite family lines lifetimes and the auto makers would be few replacing what was damaged, wrecked etc.

Failure is inevitable. BUT the OEMs are now using that truth as a business model and coloring it as "Regulations". Which is true as well. Goody for them. They have a valid reason not to do the right thing.... when they most certainly could. Not telling the whole story is not the same thing as telling the truth and not getting caught in your lie is not the same thing as telling the truth.

I'm personally amazed by the smoke and mirrors/dog and pony show. They get away with it because, frankly, people are ignorant. Not stupid, just unaware, uneducated and yea, sometimes stupid when this state becomes willful. People are also greedy and self-centered creatures. You do drive on this country's roads, right?

Compromise in the field of oil is not the same thing as a compromise with your mate.

Here's a truth. Fuel Economy and Wear prevention are opposite ends of the same crap covered stick. The FULCURM is VISCOSITY. It's the only bone in that dogs body. VISCOSITY. But it is not an infinite scaling.

Less viscosity = better MPG's UNTIL it becomes so low parts touch parts HARD ENOUGH to create power robbing friction WITHOUT a "NOTICALBE" increase in wear. Push it far enough and yea, BOOM!

More viscosity = better wear protection UNTIL it becomes so high more doesn't improve wear and added drag decreases mpg.

The industry and regulators are moving the fulcrum closer and closer to failure and getting help at every front with 'Expectation Management'. They are now falling off that table with increasing regularity and getting sued silly and STILL getting away with it. :mad:

They are NOT looking for the best balance. They are looking for the most profitable monetizable situation. Sadly, that puts wear on the back burner and fuel economy on the front burner.

And boy are they getting takers. People accepting dumbed down expectations like crows looking at a shiny thing.

You have to go through pages of a web advert at an OEM just to find out what the powertrain makeup is. But connectivity is on the first page. People don't even care what the mechanicals are anymore. MOST PEOPLE not all people.

The deeper I dig into the subject of viscosity the more I shake my head in disbelief. The truth is so deeply hidden it just as well could not exist. Oil people telling you......You don't need to know. TRUST ME as you drive your problematic ride.

:rant:

Edited August 21 by Grumpy Bear

KARNUT · August 21

2 minutes ago, Grumpy Bear said:

In a perfect world a machine would never ever wear out. The lubricant would prevent any possible contact between surfaces. It is its main job. Prevent parts from touching other parts. And the lubricant would never wear out. (Think air bearings).

IF that were true, and it cannot be; one car per family would last infinite family lines lifetimes and the auto makers would be few replacing what was damaged, wrecked etc.

Failure is inevitable. BUT the OEMs are now using that truth as a business model and coloring it as "Regulations". Which is true as well. Goody for them. They have a valid reason not to do the right thing.... when they most certainly could. Not telling the whole story is not the same thing as telling the truth and not getting caught in your lie is not the same thing as telling the truth.

I'm personally amazed by the smoke and mirrors/dog and pony show. They get away with it because, frankly, people are ignorant. Not stupid, just unaware, uneducated and yea, sometimes stupid when this state becomes willful. People are also greedy and self-centered creatures. You do drive on this country's roads, right?

Compromise in the field of oil is not the same thing as a compromise with your mate.

Here's a truth. Fuel Economy and Wear prevention are opposite ends of the same crap covered stick. The FULCURM is VISCOSITY. It's the only bone in that dogs body. VISCOSITY. But it is not an infinite scaling.

Less viscosity = better MPG's UNTIL it becomes so low parts touch parts HARD ENOUGH to create power robbing friction WITHOUT a "NOTICALBE" increase in wear.

More viscosity = better wear protection UNTIL it becomes so high more doesn't improve wear and added drag decreases mpg.

The industry and regulators are moving the fulcrum closer and closer to failure and getting help at every front with 'Expectation Management'. They are now falling off that table with increasing regularity and getting sued silly and STILL getting away with it.

They are NOT looking for the best balance. They are looking for the most profitable balance. Sadly, that puts wear on the back burner and fuel economy on the front burner.

And boy are they getting takers. People accepting dumbed down expectations like crows looking at a shiny thing.

You have to go through pages of a web advert at an OEM just to find out what the powertrain makeup is. But connectivity is on the first page. People don't even care what the mechanicals are anymore. MOST PEOPLE not all people.

The deeper I dig into the subject of viscosity the more I shake my head in disbelief. The truth is so deeply hidden it just as well could not exist. Oil people telling you......You don't need to know. TRUST ME as you drive your problematic ride.

It’s funny what you claim. All the while vehicles are getting cleaner and lasting longer. It’s not any kind of conspiracy. It’s marketing. Someone makes a better mouse trap to compete the competition has to at least match that. Or make the mouse trap faster or prettier. If everything lasts forever there would be no economy. The human condition is to get bored. Want something new. Usually it’s our government that tries to change our direction or destiny. Once we think we got it figured out they change the rules. Global cooling, global warming, climate change. A car that’s last forever. No thank you. How many times have you seen people remodel a perfectly functional house. Change is the only thing that keeps people going.

customboss · August 21

1 hour ago, Silverado4x4 said:

:nopity:

Edited August 21 by customboss

customboss · August 21

1 hour ago, Grumpy Bear said:

HVHI. Did you mean HVI? High viscosity index hydraulic oil.

VHVI OILS

Definition: VHVI stands for Very High Viscosity Index, referring to a type of mineral base oil with an exceptionally high viscosity index (VI) of above 110. This means the oil’s viscosity remains stable over a wide temperature range.
Properties: VHVI oils exhibit:
- Low pour point (-35°C or lower), allowing for better cold-start performance
- High flash point, ensuring safer operation and reduced risk of ignition
- Good thermal conductivity, effectively dispersing heat from friction surfaces
- Compatibility with both diesel and petrol engines, as well as automatic transmissions (AT) and continuously variable transmissions (CVT)
Advantages:
- Longer oil change intervals, potentially up to 50% more mileage
- Reduced environmental impact due to less frequent oil disposal
- Economical benefits for vehicle owners, as they require less frequent oil changes and storage space
- Suitable for universal use in various engine and transmission applications
Applications: VHVI oils are suitable for a wide range of vehicles, including passenger cars, commercial vehicles, and industrial equipment, where high-performance lubrication and extended oil change intervals are desired.

Grumpy Bear · August 21

3 hours ago, KARNUT said:

It’s funny what you claim. All the while vehicles are getting cleaner and lasting longer. It’s not any kind of conspiracy. It’s marketing. Someone makes a better mouse trap to compete the competition has to at least match that. Or make the mouse trap faster or prettier. If everything lasts forever there would be no economy. The human condition is to get bored. Want something new. Usually it’s our government that tries to change our direction or destiny. Once we think we got it figured out they change the rules. Global cooling, global warming, climate change. A car that’s last forever. No thank you. How many times have you seen people remodel a perfectly functional house. Change is the only thing that keeps people going.

I gave you an off ramp. Why not take it?

I'm not going to get the point across to you that not everyone is YOU. Want's what you want. Thinks like you think. Maintains like you do.

Funny really. You know human nature:

3 hours ago, KARNUT said:

The human condition is to get bored. Want something new.

Not everyone Stan. So no, I don't understand why it is so important to you that others don't get what they want? Information. Why pi$$ all over information? What is in it for you?

Why must everyone buy like you buy, Buy what you buy. Maintain as you maintain. That is exactly how you come across.

Me, I like options, and I like them explained. When I learn them, I like to share them. If you really hate this idea so bad then I have a thought. DON'T read it. Turn the channel. Put down that magazine.

I just provide information. Use it. Don't use it. My machine runs the same. :wtf:

KARNUT · August 21

21 minutes ago, Grumpy Bear said:

I gave you an off ramp. Why not take it?

I'm not going to get the point across to you that not everyone is YOU. Want's what you want. Thinks like you think. Maintains like you do.

Funny really. You know human nature:

Not everyone Stan. So no, I don't understand why it is so important to you that others don't get what they want? Information. Why pi$$ all over information? What is in it for you?

Why must everyone buy like you buy, Buy what you buy. Maintain as you maintain. That is exactly how you come across.

Me, I like options, and I like them explained. When I learn them, I like to share them. If you really hate this idea so bad then I have a thought. DON'T read it. Turn the channel. Put down that magazine.

I just provide information. Use it. Don't use it. My machine runs the same.

I’ve made a determination that you’re not normal. You live in an alternate universe. I thought I lived in a bubble. No I don’t, not like you. No you don’t like opinions. You want everything you’ve way. I simply share my experiences. You want assimilation. I want diversity. My experiences are closer to normal. I don’t like your sandbox. I’ll answer anything I like. You can choose not to read it. Bye Bye. Ps, you don’t need to give me anything. I earned my way. Quite well I may add.

PunchT37 · August 21

Information, if accurate, is what it is. Specs, if accurate, are what they are. Then, choose what you believe is right for your application. What one selects is not going to be the same for all thought processes, or application even though it`s the same equipment.

Where and how it`s used along with the operator`s thoughts are not going to be the same. Since we`re on oil, I will never have a 6000 mile plus OCI. Period. And, what is 6000 miles on oil? Temps, weather, rpm`s, idle time without clicking off miles? One man`s 6000 mile OCI is gonna be different than another`s as far as breakdown on oil even in the same equipment.

KARNUT · August 21

52 minutes ago, PunchT37 said:

Information, if accurate, is what it is. Specs, if accurate, are what they are. Then, choose what you believe is right for your application. What one selects is not going to be the same for all thought processes, or application even though it`s the same equipment.

Where and how it`s used along with the operator`s thoughts are not going to be the same. Since we`re on oil, I will never have a 6000 mile plus OCI. Period. And, what is 6000 miles on oil? Temps, weather, rpm`s, idle time without clicking off miles? One man`s 6000 mile OCI is gonna be different than another`s as far as breakdown on oil even in the same equipment.

You’re talking common sense that’s not allowed . Hwy miles is different than city driving. Constant temperature is different than extreme temperature.

Edited August 21 by KARNUT