What 5W-30 oil brand are you using for the 6.6L gas?

SoCal Angler · August 15, 2023

Getting prepared for the first oil change at 500 miles, as I will begin towing after 500 miles. Manual calls for an oil change before towing.

What brand of 5W-30 are you using?

I found:

The Dexos 1 brand is difficult to source anywhere other than local dealer.

Costco sells Mobil 1 that has the Dexos 1 approved label on the bottle.

Is the Mobil 1 preferred if the Dexos 1 is not available or double the price?

I'll be using the AC Delco PF63 oil filter.

Thanks

diyer2 · August 15, 2023

Any oil that meets spec. I would follow severe duty OCI's.

newdude · August 15, 2023

36 minutes ago, SoCal Angler said:

Getting prepared for the first oil change at 500 miles, as I will begin towing after 500 miles. Manual calls for an oil change before towing.

What brand of 5W-30 are you using?

I found:

The Dexos 1 brand is difficult to source anywhere other than local dealer.

Costco sells Mobil 1 that has the Dexos 1 approved label on the bottle.

Is the Mobil 1 preferred if the Dexos 1 is not available or double the price?

I'll be using the AC Delco PF63 oil filter.

Thanks

Dexos isn't a brand. Its GM's specification. The bottled oil at the dealer is AC Delco "Dexos" 5w30. Its a Mobil product in a Mobil bottle.

99.9% of the 5w30 oils sold in stores are Dexos spec oils. Run any flavor you'd like. Walmart is usually a great place as they always have the 5 quart jugs on sale.

Grumpy Bear · August 15, 2023

Both above answers are true. But so is this:

They are not all the same even though they carry the license. The Spec isn't a point, it's a range or in some cases a limit.

Not all NON-Dexos oils are inferior. A few actual spec to a higher bar. As your initial post suggests you are cost conscious, I doubt any of those oils will be on your radar.

Given the limits your post implies, you're a candidate for 3K OCI's no matter what the bottle claims. IMHO naturally.

The base oil exchange restrictions on the Dexos license inhibits solvency and the additive package limits shorten hinderance. The chemistry does not stop deposits. It slows the rate at which they build. Leaves you with one bullet. OCI to keep those rings clean and timing chain alive.

Also, lean to the high side of the *W30 spec on 100 C viscosity and HTHS.

Edited August 15, 2023 by Grumpy Bear

ssgballistics · August 16, 2023

I ran quaker state full synthetic in my last truck (22’ 2500 hd 6.6 gasser). It has gotten harder to reliably find. My new truck (24’ 2500 hd 6.6 gasser) I’m going to run Mobil 1. I run 5k mile intervals.

Also, I also run the ac delco oil filters. I buy them from rock auto by the case of 12 for around $3.35 each. I’ve cut open a lot of oil filters. I’ve always liked what I saw in the ac delcos.

I’m a believer that a good diet of name brand dexos 1 gen 3 and ac delco filters will ensure that engine stays happy for a long time.

Edited August 16, 2023 by ssgballistics
Added oil filter comments.

Another JR · August 16, 2023

I’ve been running Castol Edge (formerly Castrol Syntec) “full synthetic” 5w-30 for 30 years in my GM trucks and Volt with no problems. Even on my 150k mile K2500 5.7 and and 150k mile 2004 Yukon 5.3 I do not have to add oil between oil changes. I don’t know how Castrol compares in lab tests to the competitors, but it has worked fine for me with 3-4k oil change I intervals. I do not tow a heavy trailer, though.

Edited August 16, 2023 by Another JR
Typo

64BAwagon · August 16, 2023

I have some 5W30 Dex1 G2 that I need to use up. Probably under 5k change intervals.

After that its probably Kirkland 5W30 D1G3 and the UPF63 filters

Grumpy Bear · August 16, 2023

Curiosity is killing me. Ya all knows oil changes over time with the government driven SAE or Licensing requirements and occasional advancements in base oil and additive chemistry and/or blender cost-based downgrades. Right?

So, what impact do you believe your life experience has with a certain brand?

I.E., "I've used XYZ for forty years and never had an issue".

:lurk:

Another JR · August 16, 2023

15 minutes ago, Grumpy Bear said:

Curiosity is killing me. Ya all knows oil changes over time with the government driven SAE or Licensing requirements and occasional advancements in base oil and additive chemistry and/or blender cost-based downgrades. Right?

So, what impact do you believe your life experience has with a certain brand?

I.E., "I've used XYZ for forty years and never had an issue".

Acknowledged. I’m just posting my experience for what it’s worth. I think my 3-4k mile oil change intervals are just as important as oil type.

Grumpy Bear · August 16, 2023

1 minute ago, Another JR said:

Acknowledged. I’m just posting my experience for what it’s worth. I think my 3-4k mile oil change intervals are just as important as oil type.

Wasn't targeting you Jon. Sorry if it felt that way. It just made me think. It was a generalized observation. I think short OCI is important as well.

Kendal oil in 1928 made the claim of a motor oil that was good for 2,000 miles. Dad tells me that before that, 500 miles was a common recommendation. 3K was a marketing ploy and 5-7.5K came from manufacturing with the advent of Group II base oils. The 10K-25K or even 'never change your oil recommendations come from boutique blenders.

Grp II III Hafner 25th (2).pdf

The Story Behind Oil Change Recommendations (repairpal.com)

Both the manufacture and the market base OCI on 'wishes' and gadgets. Little on science. Labs and STLE CLS/OMA's jumped on the wagon. That may sound odd but if you dig deep enough into wear studies published by the SAE you'd find they are largely ignored and preference to marketing hype and governmental regulation has taken over.

Thing is that machines don't subjugate themselves to wishes or rules. They respond to the laws of the universe. We can study them and even profit from what we study IF it is applied routinely.

OCI's have lengthened. Oil has improved. Just not to the values or pace the industry or government wishes them. Their agenda has nothing to do with wear control or your financial best interests. Sadly, it also has nothing to do with the environment either.

Another JR · August 16, 2023

3 hours ago, Grumpy Bear said:

Wasn't targeting you Jon. Sorry if it felt that way. It just made me think. It was a generalized observation. I think short OCI is important as well.

No offense taken whatsoever, GB! I thought you made an important point that oil formulations change over the years.

Grumpy Bear · August 17, 2023

8 hours ago, Another JR said:

No offense taken whatsoever, GB! I thought you made an important point that oil formulations change over the years.

They do and it isn't always for the betterment of the end user. Sometimes it is. The lack of truthful and accurate information is hidden in the baskets called "trade secret" and "intellectual property". Neither is true. Takes a day or two testing for one blender to unveil another blenders chemistry. They are not just fast. They are good at it. Not just what it is made of but right down to which unit made it and what reserve/field it came from. The end user is the only one blinded by this garbage. And they, being blind, IS the advantage to the blender. If I don't tell you how many olives, I put in a jar you will never know when I leave one out. Chevron knew this so well it SHARED GULF OIL technology (they bought GULF during my tenure) with others to enhance acceptance of the new processes.

As could be read in the links provided, the advent Group II fluids was the start of more resistant fluids that allowed lower treat rates. Doesn't take much imagination for even a layman to understand that this has LIMITS. Those limits have been exceeded often and hard. Often due to governmental interference. The cure for that is to move the goal post. Expectation modification. Labs use to condemn oils when reserve alkalinity reached a TBN of 4. Blackstone currently runs consumers down to a TBN of 1 with assistance in the miseducation of the public by those being crippled by outside forces. The GM wear studies are just as valid today as they were when published and the physics of the Strebeck Curve have not been altered by repainting the endzone.

Whatever real and tangible improvements have been made in the chemistry have been used up in spades by the OEM's with harsher operational environments. Again, forced by governmental goals with a now more transparent goal of making the bar so high it cannot be met and forcing a new agenda. Electrification!

Sometimes they go so far as to cripple their own efforts. 194F thermostats on 6L80E transmissions got a walk back about two decades when the limits of the engineering were exceeded, and warranty failure ate their lunch. A SECOND TIME. They went through this when Whale Oil was removed from ATF in the 70's and transmission failures nearly sank their boat while claiming the new chemistry was not just 'as good as' but better than. A bald-faced lie.

I run Red Line HP only 5K miles and run out of TBN. I know a guy who runs Pennzoil Ultra Platinum but 2K miles before the VII pack has sheard down a full SAE grade. We know these things because we LOOK and don't take a manufactures or blenders word for it. I change shelf oil between 2K and 3K. When the UOA is telling me it is done, and I stick it with a fork.

Even GM reprogrammed the OLM to a much shorter OCI of many a 2.4 in their SUVs. I have two of those pigs.

You have to LOOK to know what is optimal.

:rant:

Edited August 17, 2023 by Grumpy Bear

diyer2 · August 17, 2023

I believe the old saying " if it sounds too good to be true it probably is"

So I always changed fluids on shorter OCI's as you know.

I just changed the oil in our Santa Fe at 4400 miles. Amsoil OE with a Purolator Boss filter. Amsoil OE is marketed as a 7500 mile oil. Severe duty oil changes for the SF is 3750. I went a little over my goal of 4000 OCI's.

This oil was dirty enough to me at 4400 miles. NO WAY I would go 7500 miles.

JUST CHANGE FLUIDS MORE OFTEN and the marketing hype doesn't matter.

64BAwagon · August 21, 2023

On 8/16/2023 at 11:05 PM, Grumpy Bear said:

They do and it isn't always for the betterment of the end user. Sometimes it is. The lack of truthful and accurate information is hidden in the baskets called "trade secret" and "intellectual property". Neither is true. Takes a day or two testing for one blender to unveil another blenders chemistry. They are not just fast. They are good at it. Not just what it is made of but right down to which unit made it and what reserve/field it came from. The end user is the only one blinded by this garbage. And they, being blind, IS the advantage to the blender. If I don't tell you how many olives, I put in a jar you will never know when I leave one out. Chevron knew this so well it SHARED GULF OIL technology (they bought GULF during my tenure) with others to enhance acceptance of the new processes.

As could be read in the links provided, the advent Group II fluids was the start of more resistant fluids that allowed lower treat rates. Doesn't take much imagination for even a layman to understand that this has LIMITS. Those limits have been exceeded often and hard. Often due to governmental interference. The cure for that is to move the goal post. Expectation modification. Labs use to condemn oils when reserve alkalinity reached a TBN of 4. Blackstone currently runs consumers down to a TBN of 1 with assistance in the miseducation of the public by those being crippled by outside forces. The GM wear studies are just as valid today as they were when published and the physics of the Strebeck Curve have not been altered by repainting the endzone.

Whatever real and tangible improvements have been made in the chemistry have been used up in spades by the OEM's with harsher operational environments. Again, forced by governmental goals with a now more transparent goal of making the bar so high it cannot be met and forcing a new agenda. Electrification!

Sometimes they go so far as to cripple their own efforts. 194F thermostats on 6L80E transmissions got a walk back about two decades when the limits of the engineering were exceeded, and warranty failure ate their lunch. A SECOND TIME. They went through this when Whale Oil was removed from ATF in the 70's and transmission failures nearly sank their boat while claiming the new chemistry was not just 'as good as' but better than. A bald-faced lie.

I run Red Line HP only 5K miles and run out of TBN. I know a guy who runs Pennzoil Ultra Platinum but 2K miles before the VII pack has sheard down a full SAE grade. We know these things because we LOOK and don't take a manufactures or blenders word for it. I change shelf oil between 2K and 3K. When the UOA is telling me it is done, and I stick it with a fork.

Even GM reprogrammed the OLM to a much shorter OCI of many a 2.4 in their SUVs. I have two of those pigs.

You have to LOOK to know what is optimal.

So acknowledging all that what are your thoughts on Dex1G2 vs Dex1G3 ? I have at least 3 oil changes of G2 left over that I will use in my 6.6 gas HD. Does the G2 designation warrant a shorter OCI ? I typically change at 5k due to the amount of towing I do.

I dont do analysis on a regular basis on my own vehicles other than the occasional instance when I feel like I need to validate a choice. The only time I did one for oil change extending was on my LLY durmamax. I ran that one out to 12k with Delvac syn 5W40 and it still wasnt anywhere near condemning.

Thanks

Scott

Edited August 21, 2023 by 64BAwagon

Grumpy Bear · August 21, 2023

1 minute ago, 64BAwagon said:

So acknowledging all that what are your thoughts on Dex1G2 vs Dex1G3 ? I have at least 3 oil changes of G2 left over that I will use in my 6.6 gas HD. Does the G2 designation warrant a shorter OCI ? I typically change at 5k due to the amount of towing I do.

Thanks

Scott

Hello Scott:

Have a read and pay attention to the comparison box: Dexos 1 Gen 2 vs Gen 3: The Ultimate Comparison (rally-america.com)

Note that there was NO LIMIT to the amount of Group II/II+ fluids that were allowed in Gen 2? Yea, a Dexos license in an oil that had been around since what, the 1970's. Now a 30% limit. Of course, oxidation and sludge will improve.

Note that not only is there a limit on deposit control but there is a MINIMUM as well???? :crackup:

Mostly Gen3 allows the addition of 0W16 oils and a modest improvement over one or two SAE SP standards.

SAE SP oils ALSO have a 0.8% ask cap and must meet a 15% maximum NOAK. Gen 3 is 12.5%. Gen3 and SAE SP have lowered the average TBN. Because of improved base oil mix MAYBE but how will that play out in an OCI? :dunno:

Pretty sure :dunno: is not the answer you are looking for, but it is the one I have. Actually, I can do better. Test the use oil.

When the object is simple the test can be as well. IF you are willing to pay for both a TBN and TAN then don't let them cross. TBN falls, TAN rises. If not and the test only gives a TBN or you don't want to pay for a TAN then set 4 as the floor. Keep an eye on fuel and viscosity as well. Blackstone is cheap and will run a TAN with the base kit for a small fee. Oil Analyzers is also inexpensive. Send a sample at 3K but keep driving until you get the results. if good test again at 5K. FIND the limit of the oil you choose.

I have no rabbit to pull from my hat. I get 5K out of Red Line HP Euro. Another member here gets about 2.8/3K from the same oil in a different motor. It really is case by case.