2023 Blacksheep?

64BAwagon · April 30, 2023

I am reading a lot of anecdotal comments with no data to back it up. (other than @the8rotor) Opinion is great and we all have one but its just that, an opinion, until some data gets let into the mix. The 6 speed was okay, but it had its issues as well. The torque converters were a potential weak link and if they failed they generally wiped out the pump. The guys at precision transmission discuss this at length on their Youtube page as well as several of the companies that sell the upgraded TC's.

As far as the 10 speed failures, so far the trans has only been used by GM in the Duramax. An application with twice the torque as the gas engine. I dont have any source to cite but my reading has shown that the problems are revealed when power is added above stock. Thats not an issue exclusive to the 10L1000, it happened with the earlier 1000 series 5 and 6 speed Allison's

I assume that GM has data on both transmissions regarding warranty failures but I am certain we will never see or hear it.

Had I kept my 2021 with the 6 speed I was planning on replacing the TC with a billet unit. Since I tow a fifth wheel around 12k I was convinced it was worth the money it would cost. Thats just my opinion though based on my research.

Edited April 30, 2023 by 64BAwagon

the8rotor · April 30, 2023

@64BAwagon great comments. Jury is obviously still out on the strength and durability of the 10L1000 in the gasser trucks. Your reliability concerns with the 6L90 TC is also very well-known as well and should be considered as much as the few 10L1000 issues paired to the Duramax.

I myself was starting to have goofy random "slips" and hard-shifts at 30k miles that I was noticing the more I towed in my 2021 GMC. After replacing a torque converter in my 2015 1500 at 190k miles - I know the signs and was concerned I was headed down that same path with my 2021 GMC 2500.

One other funny thing to mention is the Ford TorqShift 10R140 is considered by nearly every shop that has opened up the transmission to be a FAR superior unit when working properly in comparison to the 10L1000 and Dodge's 8 speed. Now, those 10R140 transmissions have a ton of problems (even my Ford buddies will admit), but they don't give the vast majority of their owners problems.

Everyone likes to stick measure!

DuckBoi · April 30, 2023

23 minutes ago, the8rotor said:

@64BAwagon great comments. Jury is obviously still out on the strength and durability of the 10L1000 in the gasser trucks. Your reliability concerns with the 6L90 TC is also very well-known as well and should be considered as much as the few 10L1000 issues paired to the Duramax.

I myself was starting to have goofy random "slips" and hard-shifts at 30k miles that I was noticing the more I towed in my 2021 GMC. After replacing a torque converter in my 2015 1500 at 190k miles - I know the signs and was concerned I was headed down that same path with my 2021 GMC 2500.

One other funny thing to mention is the Ford TorqShift 10R140 is considered by nearly every shop that has opened up the transmission to be a FAR superior unit when working properly in comparison to the 10L1000 and Dodge's 8 speed. Now, those 10R140 transmissions have a ton of problems (even my Ford buddies will admit), but they don't give the vast majority of their owners problems.

Everyone likes to stick measure!

Interesting comments on the transmission's! I apologize for the misinformation. Did your hill start assist act up on you on your 2021 gmc? Its acted up on me on flat ground and has locked me in a complete stand still several times just trying to take off from stop signs or when the light turns green. Flashes on the dash "hill start assist engaged" and it wont let me move for several seconds.

IDBrett · April 30, 2023

Great comments by all! Opinions and real world experience. All food for thought.

I do have a deposit on a 23 that had an arrival date of May 18th. A couple days ago it got moved up to the 11th. That is great but stressful at the same time. I am preapproved for a loan and have a down payment. But for a truck payment to fit in the budget other "stuff" has to be taken care of. I've been selling hobby stuff at crazy break neck speed. The shortened time frame will have me upping my game.

My loan rate is locked for 6 months so I'm safe if I don't reach my goal by the 11th. Which is part of the reason I started this thread. I want to consider a '24 with a 10 speed. Like I need to add complexity to an already monumental financial decision. As I said in another thread, I haven't bought a new vehicle since 1995.

I enjoy the technical side of the discussion. It occupies my grey matter like a distraction from the money side of thoughts to a new truck. Thanks all.

the8rotor · April 30, 2023

28 minutes ago, DuckBoi said:

Interesting comments on the transmission's! I apologize for the misinformation. Did your hill start assist act up on you on your 2021 gmc? Its acted up on me on flat ground and has locked me in a complete stand still several times just trying to take off from stop signs or when the light turns green. Flashes on the dash "hill start assist engaged" and it wont let me move for several seconds.

No worries brother, we are all here to learn and discuss trucks!

I did have intermittent hill start issues on my 2021. Particularly backing up on a hill unloaded I was locked out/or heard a split-second grind noise.

DuckBoi · April 30, 2023

2 minutes ago, the8rotor said:

No worries brother, we are all here to learn and discuss trucks!

I did have intermittent hill start issues on my 2021. Particularly backing up on a hill unloaded I was locked out/or heard a split-second grind noise.

Yep mine always makes that split second grind noise too. The other day just driving, it constantly did it back to back. So annoying. I wish we could remove the hill start assist crap. Its going to cause an accident one day i swear when someone rear ends me because my truck refuses to move and stops itself completely.

the8rotor · April 30, 2023

17 minutes ago, IDBrett said:

Great comments by all! Opinions and real world experience. All food for thought.

I do have a deposit on a 23 that had an arrival date of May 18th. A couple days ago it got moved up to the 11th. That is great but stressful at the same time. I am preapproved for a loan and have a down payment. But for a truck payment to fit in the budget other "stuff" has to be taken care of. I've been selling hobby stuff at crazy break neck speed. The shortened time frame will have me upping my game.

My loan rate is locked for 6 months so I'm safe if I don't reach my goal by the 11th. Which is part of the reason I started this thread. I want to consider a '24 with a 10 speed. Like I need to add complexity to an already monumental financial decision. As I said in another thread, I haven't bought a new vehicle since 1995.

I enjoy the technical side of the discussion. It occupies my grey matter like a distraction from the money side of thoughts to a new truck. Thanks all.

You won't be disappointed with either the 6 or 10spd. Coming from someone that's owned both, I would be happy with either drivetrain. Bear in mind the 2024 orders are at least 6 months out before shipment. I settled on my 2024 because I didn't want to wait - so I was okay with halogen headlights and cloth interior.

the8rotor · April 30, 2023

Just now, DuckBoi said:

Yep mine always makes that split second grind noise too. The other day just driving, it constantly did it back to back. So annoying. I wish we could remove the hill start assist crap. Its going to cause an accident one day i swear when someone rear ends me because my truck refuses to move and stops itself completely.

I purposely keep backing and starting forward on a hill in my new truck. If it makes any hill start noise I'm coming unglued

DuckBoi · April 30, 2023

1 minute ago, the8rotor said:

I purposely keep backing and starting forward on a hill in my new truck. If it makes any hill start noise I'm coming unglued

Hahaha. Mine keeps engaging itself on flat level ground. Never engages when im actually on a hill. Faulty? Idk but its annoying and i hate it. That is my one major complaint with this truck.

Dr1ft3r · April 30, 2023

6 hours ago, 64BAwagon said:

I am reading a lot of anecdotal comments with no data to back it up. (other than @the8rotor) Opinion is great and we all have one but its just that, an opinion, until some data gets let into the mix. The 6 speed was okay, but it had its issues as well. The torque converters were a potential weak link and if they failed they generally wiped out the pump. The guys at precision transmission discuss this at length on their Youtube page as well as several of the companies that sell the upgraded TC's.

As far as the 10 speed failures, so far the trans has only been used by GM in the Duramax. An application with twice the torque as the gas engine. I dont have any source to cite but my reading has shown that the problems are revealed when power is added above stock. Thats not an issue exclusive to the 10L1000, it happened with the earlier 1000 series 5 and 6 speed Allison's

I assume that GM has data on both transmissions regarding warranty failures but I am certain we will never see or hear it.

Had I kept my 2021 with the 6 speed I was planning on replacing the TC with a billet unit. Since I tow a fifth wheel around 12k I was convinced it was worth the money it would cost. Thats just my opinion though based on my research.

This entire thread is an opinion. Starting with the opinion that the 2023 is no longer desirable.

Edited April 30, 2023 by Dr1ft3r

Pryme · April 30, 2023

What is the hill start assist? I don’t even think my truck has that feature. Guess I prefer less features though

DuckBoi · April 30, 2023

6 minutes ago, Pryme said:

What is the hill start assist? I don’t even think my truck has that feature. Guess I prefer less features though

2014 and newer vehicles all have hill start assist.

Pryme · April 30, 2023

1 hour ago, DuckBoi said:

2014 and newer vehicles all have hill start assist.

I’ve never noticed anything assisting me on a hill or any wordage stating such.

64BAwagon · April 30, 2023

"diminished the desirability of the 23's"

Theres a difference in the two comments @Dr1ft3r

DuckBoi · May 1, 2023

6 hours ago, Pryme said:

I’ve never noticed anything assisting me on a hill or any wordage stating such.

They call it that. It really is just an intrusion that makes your vehicle randomly stop and not allow you to move for 5 seconds with a loud clunk and grinding noise when you are not even on hills. Its awful. People wanted it so they put it in. Look up what it is for yourself.