Carbon Fiber Truck Bed Is The Best Way to Stunt on Other Truck Owners

f8l vnm · November 16, 2020

On 11/14/2020 at 7:27 AM, newdude said:

LMAO. Carbon Pro box is a flop. GM did their best attempt at Protec box 2.0 and learned nothing from that. Look at the build and price for example on an AT4 with the AT4 Carbonpro Edition. Why is it packaged as a "special edition"? Its $1070 for the option, but you need to also get the AT4 Premium and Preferred packages, and also either the 6.2 or the 3.0 diesel. So you need $5000 in options to then add the $1070 bed option.

Why on earth can't GM get their heads out of their @sses. Carbon Pro box should be STANDARD on Denali and AT4 seeing they are the premium trims, and at least an option on SLT. They are the only ones on the market with a carbon composite pickup bed, why not flaunt it? Why not have more availability? Why is it only on the 5ft8in box?

Watch GM drop the option all together...

Very well stated sir. 100% agree should be standard on AT and Denali trims. Will be interesting to see if it will be on 22 models

2016 Sierra Owner · November 16, 2020

On 11/13/2020 at 3:21 PM, Gangly said:

I thought I saw this exact meme on this post a few months ago and thought it was hilarious then. Not sure what's going on, lol.

Yeah that was me with the same meme a few month ago as well.

the wanderer · November 16, 2020

On 11/14/2020 at 3:37 PM, OnTheReel said:

In the volume trims they are better than before. But if you load them up, it still dwindles away to nothing. Ram Limited had an as-tested payload of 990 pounds. A loaded to the max Denali is still over 1400 pounds. I know the Ram is better equipped and rides better but they still need to trim some fat.

I have a very well equipped big horn with 1750 pounds of payload. There are plenty of nearly loaded limiteds with 1200 pounds.

Keep in mind that a panoramic sunroof, etorque + battery, ram boxes, air suspension etc all are very heavy features, and none of those are available on your max Denali. So yes, the Ram is better equipped, but I don't see how they can trim some fat. People want the massive sunroof, you can't have your cake and eat it.

OnTheReel · November 16, 2020

26 minutes ago, the wanderer said:

So yes, the Ram is better equipped, but I don't see how they can trim some fat. People want the massive sunroof, you can't have your cake and eat it.

Modern materials. Did I not just suggest they make their own carbonpro bed? Or aluminum on more than just a tailgate? They left a lot on the table with the new architecture, that's my only point. They left body heavy and the powertrain old (aside from the consolation E-Torque that nobody can tell is there). F150 has a pano roof and massaging seats, weighs 500lbs less.

the wanderer · November 16, 2020

1 minute ago, OnTheReel said:

Modern materials. Did I not just suggest they make their own carbonpro bed? Or aluminum on more than just a tailgate? They left a lot on the table with the new architecture, that's my only point. They left body heavy and the powertrain old (aside from the consolation E-Torque that nobody can tell is there). F150 has a pano roof and massaging seats, weighs 500lbs less.

Ram did more than you are suggesting they did. They have aluminum tailgates + hood, high strength steel frames + rails, cross members, fenders and outer doors. The bed is either HSS or "advanced" high strength steel.

It's not as far as Ford, but those ride and tow like crap. Jittery with lots of side/rear skipping.

Weight is generally a bad thing, but it does have an advantage for stability, especially while towing. I'm more than happy driving my truck with "500 pounds extra" over the Ford. It's a truck, not a civic.

OnTheReel · November 16, 2020

GM used HSS extensively on the K2s of 6 years ago, whoop-de-do. They were lighter than the Ram then, and are now.

A very low optioned Ram Laramie with bench seat and no sun roof weighs 300lbs more than my LTZ with a sun roof and every other option. That’s not even an apples to apples, it’s actually skewed in the Ram’s favor and still we get that result.

From where I sit, it looks like FCA spent the bulk of their money on the interior development, and made the compromise in using mostly traditional materials to save cash. It’s heavier not only because of it’s equipment level, but because of it’s construction.

The Ram’s compromise seems to have paid off in the short term. But GM has the better bones to build off of with the 2022 refresh. And the 2021 F150 also shows you can have the goodies without growing obese. The nice thing is we benefit from competition and get to pick what’s most important to us when we shop! There’s no wrong answers.

JR09country · November 17, 2020

GM used HSS extensively on the K2s of 6 years ago, whoop-de-do. They were lighter than the Ram then, and are now...

Well said.
GM rushed their trucks out to compete with Ram and were not fully prepared. A lot of the R&D money went into the bones of the truck itself , new electrical architecture, new braking system, new frame, more aluminum usage, all new cab and panels, and more. GM knew they would lose the initial battle but is better prepared to win the long term war.... In theory. Ha.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using Tapatalk

Fringe · November 21, 2020

On 11/14/2020 at 3:02 PM, Cpl_Punishment said:

I thought it was only the pre-2019 Rams that had Tundra-like payload. Are the new ones no better?

might be better

the wanderer · November 22, 2020

On 11/16/2020 at 1:01 PM, OnTheReel said:

GM used HSS extensively on the K2s of 6 years ago, whoop-de-do. They were lighter than the Ram then, and are now.

A very low optioned Ram Laramie with bench seat and no sun roof weighs 300lbs more than my LTZ with a sun roof and every other option. That’s not even an apples to apples, it’s actually skewed in the Ram’s favor and still we get that result.

From where I sit, it looks like FCA spent the bulk of their money on the interior development, and made the compromise in using mostly traditional materials to save cash. It’s heavier not only because of it’s equipment level, but because of it’s construction.

The Ram’s compromise seems to have paid off in the short term. But GM has the better bones to build off of with the 2022 refresh. And the 2021 F150 also shows you can have the goodies without growing obese. The nice thing is we benefit from competition and get to pick what’s most important to us when we shop! There’s no wrong answers.

Just saw this post now; but you can't get a bench seat in a Laramie.

No doubt the Ram is heavier, I never claimed otherwise. However, there ARE features on it which cause significant weight; the panoramic sun roof, the ram boxes, air suspension, the etorque + battery pack, the "frame shakers" to cancel vibrations in the frame, a true 4x4 transfer case (most 2019 chevys don't have 4x4 low) etc etc. All heavy features you don't get on LTZ's (4x4 low is available with Z71 package only).

To give you an idea of the range; I have an almost fully optioned out Big Horn, with a true 4x4. My payload is 1750 pounds. A loaded limited can go as low as 1100 pounds or less. Same frame, same construction, but 650 pounds difference based on options.

The Ford is lighter than all trucks, aluminum is much lighter than even HSS. Do you want to drive around in a jittery fish can? They ride like sh|t compared to my truck.

In the end, what do you want to drive? That's the real question. I don't know a single shopper that said: gee, the Ford is lighter, guess I'm gettin that. You certainly didn't care, right? Nothing from Ford can tempt you out of your 6.2. Same thing with me, I don't care what it weighs, just what it provides.

Edit: Just to be perfectly clear: I'm not a "Ram fan" in the least. I do love my truck, but I would be equally happy in a 6.2 LT/SLE. My decision was based primarily on cost, as due to discounts and dealer haggling, an LT would have cost me 10000 more for the same truck. They were offering a work truck with vinyl floors for the same price I walked out the door with my Ram.

So I'm not bashing GM in the slightest. I actually love them, especially some of the the drive trains (6.2 + 3.0 and 10 speed) and the exterior which are better than Ram at this point.

Edited November 22, 2020 by the wanderer

OnTheReel · November 22, 2020

52 minutes ago, the wanderer said:

Just saw this post now; but you can't get a bench seat in a Laramie.

No doubt the Ram is heavier, I never claimed otherwise. However, there ARE features on it which cause significant weight; the panoramic sun roof, the ram boxes, air suspension, the etorque + battery pack, the "frame shakers" to cancel vibrations in the frame, a true 4x4 transfer case (most 2019 chevys don't have 4x4 low) etc etc. All heavy features you don't get on LTZ's (4x4 low is available with Z71 package only).

To give you an idea of the range; I have an almost fully optioned out Big Horn, with a true 4x4. My payload is 1750 pounds. A loaded limited can go as low as 1100 pounds or less. Same frame, same construction, but 650 pounds difference based on options.

The Ford is lighter than all trucks, aluminum is much lighter than even HSS. Do you want to drive around in a jittery fish can? They ride like sh|t compared to my truck.

In the end, what do you want to drive? That's the real question. I don't know a single shopper that said: gee, the Ford is lighter, guess I'm gettin that. You certainly didn't care, right? Nothing from Ford can tempt you out of your 6.2. Same thing with me, I don't care what it weighs, just what it provides.

Edit: Just to be perfectly clear: I'm not a "Ram fan" in the least. I do love my truck, but I would be equally happy in a 6.2 LT/SLE. My decision was based primarily on cost, as due to discounts and dealer haggling, an LT would have cost me 10000 more for the same truck. They were offering a work truck with vinyl floors for the same price I walked out the door with my Ram.

So I'm not bashing GM in the slightest. I actually love them, especially some of the the drive trains (6.2 + 3.0 and 10 speed) and the exterior which are better than Ram at this point.

You can get a Laramie with a bench, I didn’t pull those numbers out of thin air, it’s a real vehicle owned by a real person who posted their capacities on the Ram forum. They self described it as low option, bench seat, and no sun roof. Build and price confirms it’s possible, although probably not common. People on the site also calculated the weight of all popular options. Some are not as heavy as one may think. Air suspension adds only 34lbs. Pano roof 70lbs. E-torque is 80. Ram boxes are very heavy, 163lbs. Advanced Safety Group is 50. These numbers are extrapolated off the reduction of payload capacity for each.

https://5thgenrams.com/community/threads/please-post-your-tire-and-loading-sticker.374/

I had a good enough idea of what the Ram’s weigh to make the fair assessment that I did. A Ram with less features than my truck weighs 300lbs more, therefore it is always going to be at a weight disadvantage in any fair comparison. Fair means taking into account and matching the equipment levels of each truck as much as possible.

As far as the two speed transfer case, I would say most trucks actually have it. Yes it comes with Z71 / X31 which is immensely popular, but it’s also standard with the 6.2 no matter what, standard on Denali, etc.

My payload is 1914lbs and curb weight 5386, FWIW.

I viewed the new Ram with an open mind back in 2018 when I started shopping. Not a hater. Just calling a spade a spade. It’s a heavier truck no matter what. I also personally didn’t feel the E-Torque was enough of a powertrain change. It’s running the same 5.7 since 2009 and the same 8 speed since 2013.

I know where they spent the money and where they didn’t. Nothing wrong with it, just didn’t align with my wants and needs.

Edited November 22, 2020 by OnTheReel

Jrodpic · November 22, 2020

On 6/26/2020 at 7:44 PM, Fringe said:

Bed looks all scratched up lol

the wanderer · November 22, 2020

2 hours ago, OnTheReel said:

You can get a Laramie with a bench, I didn’t pull those numbers out of thin air, it’s a real vehicle owned by a real person who posted their capacities on the Ram forum. They self described it as low option, bench seat, and no sun roof. Build and price confirms it’s possible, although probably not common. People on the site also calculated the weight of all popular options. Some are not as heavy as one may think. Air suspension adds only 34lbs. Pano roof 70lbs. E-torque is 80. Ram boxes are very heavy, 163lbs. Advanced Safety Group is 50. These numbers are extrapolated off the reduction of payload capacity for each.

https://5thgenrams.com/community/threads/please-post-your-tire-and-loading-sticker.374/

I had a good enough idea of what the Ram’s weigh to make the fair assessment that I did. A Ram with less features than my truck weighs 300lbs more, therefore it is always going to be at a weight disadvantage in any fair comparison. Fair means taking into account and matching the equipment levels of each truck as much as possible.

As far as the two speed transfer case, I would say most trucks actually have it. Yes it comes with Z71 / X31 which is immensely popular, but it’s also standard with the 6.2 no matter what, standard on Denali, etc.

My payload is 1914lbs and curb weight 5386, FWIW.

I viewed the new Ram with an open mind back in 2018 when I started shopping. Not a hater. Just calling a spade a spade. It’s a heavier truck no matter what. I also personally didn’t feel the E-Torque was enough of a powertrain change. It’s running the same 5.7 since 2009 and the same 8 speed since 2013.

I know where they spent the money and where they didn’t. Nothing wrong with it, just didn’t align with my wants and needs.

I seriously doubt you can build a Laramie with a bench. I tried. Both the online site and asking the dealer to do it manually. Each time I found out that Big Horn was the last trim. Beyond that it was buckets only. Maybe USA was different, but it's one reason I settled for my trim. And there is nothing on dealer lots. If you can find one, I'd be happy to change my mind, until then it's a myth (here in Canada anyway. We do have odd stuff, like a dedicated "sport" trim that you can't buy in the USA though you can get a sport package on top of a different trim in US)

I'm well aware of those ram threads. The problem is those numbers don't add up. I posted my weight of 650 pounds lighter than many limiteds. Clearly that 650 pounds goes somewhere, since it's the "same truck".

My curb weight is 5350. GVWR is 7100 pounds according to door sticker, payload is 1750, so doing the math that equals 5350.

I agree on etorque, I passed, but it adds weight which is what I'm discussing here. As for "running the same powertrain", keep in mind the ZF 8 speed is leagues ahead of anyother 8 speed. It's used in BMWs, Aston Martin, Alpha Romeo, and some other very pricy stuff. You guys were dealing with a pretty mediorce and jerky 8 speed all that time while Ram was running around in the better transmission. The 10 speed is apparently just as good, so well done GM/Ford, but it's not like having the 8 speed is a problem. Just down 2 gears.

Edited November 22, 2020 by the wanderer

OnTheReel · November 22, 2020

55 minutes ago, the wanderer said:

I seriously doubt you can build a Laramie with a bench. I tried. Both the online site and asking the dealer to do it manually. Each time I found out that Big Horn was the last trim. Beyond that it was buckets only. Maybe USA was different, but it's one reason I settled for my trim. And there is nothing on dealer lots. If you can find one, I'd be happy to change my mind, until then it's a myth (here in Canada anyway. We do have odd stuff, like a dedicated "sport" trim that you can't buy in the USA though you can get a sport package on top of a different trim in US)

Well, at least in the states you can build one with the bench. Again, not saying it’s a common configuration or anything. And really beside the point.

Still surprised at model year #3, Ram hasn’t done anything in the powertrain dept besides the TRX. Is there any rumors of anything in the pipeline? I thought for sure they would be doing something within a few years of introduction. Unusual move to stick with the same powertrains and outputs in such a competitive market.

the wanderer · November 23, 2020

3 hours ago, OnTheReel said:

Well, at least in the states you can build one with the bench. Again, not saying it’s a common configuration or anything. And really beside the point.

Still surprised at model year #3, Ram hasn’t done anything in the powertrain dept besides the TRX. Is there any rumors of anything in the pipeline? I thought for sure they would be doing something within a few years of introduction. Unusual move to stick with the same powertrains and outputs in such a competitive market.

I stand corrected!

As for the powertrain, agreed. The Hemi is perfectly acceptable for my usage (as is the Chevy 5.3), but I would never complain if we got something to compete more with the 6.2. I don't think anybody knows what is coming, but Jeep just dropped the 6.4 (from the 2500) in the Wrangler of all places (probably due to upcoming competition from Ford Bronco) so who knows. I suspect they were hoping the etorque would be more effective, but in practice I doubt it has any real value.

OnTheReel · November 23, 2020

6 minutes ago, the wanderer said:

I stand corrected!

As for the powertrain, agreed. The Hemi is perfectly acceptable for my usage (as is the Chevy 5.3), but I would never complain if we got something to compete more with the 6.2. I don't think anybody knows what is coming, but Jeep just dropped the 6.4 (from the 2500) in the Wrangler of all places (probably due to upcoming competition from Ford Bronco) so who knows. I suspect they were hoping the etorque would be more effective, but in practice I doubt it has any real value.

Yeah, seems like the only appreciable e-torque benefit noted in reviews is the start/stop feature. I guess it works very smooth since it can take off on the electric motor while the gasser starts up again. I would definitely prefer that to the GM system. Or nothing at all.

6.4 would be cool but I bet that thing would be a gas hog from hell.