Towing small 5th wheel with new AT4

Remington92 · September 23, 2019

Hey all I was wanting to pick your brains. Right now I’ve got a 2017 Chevy 3500 Duramax that’s been a go to town/ pull my small 22ft 5th wheel and 16 ft cargo trailer. My previous job had a company work truck so mine sits 90% of the time. My new job provides a stipend for my vehicle instead. I do a lot of gravel road and field driving working in Ag and the 1 ton ride and ruts get old in a hurry. Plus thinking bout jelled fuel this winter in Montana.

So with that said I’m debating on trading it in on a gmc at4 with the 6.5ft bed and 6.2. My question is do you think my 5th wheel will be too much for this half ton? I’ll be using a bw turnover ball and companion setup. The camper probably weighs in the neighborhood of 7k pounds loaded.

Smoothbassman · September 23, 2019

So at 7K you are well within the limits of this trucks capacity. With the 6.2 and the max tow package you can load up 9200lbs with a crew cab and standard box. It's going to suck on gas but if your not doing it all the time no worries there.

If you are then the the new 1500 diesel might be up your alley. 460 lb-ft of torque there with that setup. It's going to pull like a freight train.

All of the trailering details are available using the link below.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.chevrolet.com/content/dam/chevrolet/na/us/english/index/shopping-tools/download-catalog/02-pdf/2019-chevrolet-trailering-guide.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjVpJKGwebkAhVKhOAKHeq9CTQQFjAaegQIBRAC&usg=AOvVaw3teP9Ar9D6wENuLM4CrbmR

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amxguy1970 · September 23, 2019

Pull like a freight train? So slowly you mean right? 460 ft lbs is nice from a stop or pulling out in traffic but on the highway looking to pass or when more power is needed that 277hp isn't going to help out much.

That isn't a very heavy trailer, should be well covered by the half ton.

Tyler

Remington92 · September 23, 2019

Ok sweet. And I’ll probably do the 6.2. If I wanted a diesel I’d stick with 3500. Any idea on what the max pin weight for an at4 would be? Here’s how she’s setup now. The pontoon was a buddies and obviously won’t be behind the camper and a half ton

bshort · September 23, 2019

You'll run out of payload.

Remington92 · September 23, 2019

Run out of payload for just the camper?

bshort · September 23, 2019

17 minutes ago, Remington92 said:

Run out of payload for just the camper?

Pin weight, plus fuel, plus people.

newdude · September 23, 2019

10 hours ago, Remington92 said:

Hey all I was wanting to pick your brains. Right now I’ve got a 2017 Chevy 3500 Duramax that’s been a go to town/ pull my small 22ft 5th wheel and 16 ft cargo trailer. My previous job had a company work truck so mine sits 90% of the time. My new job provides a stipend for my vehicle instead. I do a lot of gravel road and field driving working in Ag and the 1 ton ride and ruts get old in a hurry. Plus thinking bout jelled fuel this winter in Montana.

So with that said I’m debating on trading it in on a gmc at4 with the 6.5ft bed and 6.2. My question is do you think my 5th wheel will be too much for this half ton? I’ll be using a bw turnover ball and companion setup. The camper probably weighs in the neighborhood of 7k pounds loaded.

I think its too much. Get a 3/4 ton gas GMC All Terrain 2019 or AT4 2020.

An AT4 1500 with 6.2 is rated 9200lbs conventional towing (regular hitch). I don't have any AT4 where I'm at, but we do have LT Trail Boss (same truck underneath). Here is the load label from the door jamb:

Excuse the blurriness but, Gooseneck/5th is rated at 7300lbs with an allowable 5th wheel/gooseneck 1095lbs tongue weight. Payload is 1633lbs. I assume an AT4 is less for all of those ratings because 6.2 (this TB is a 5.3) and AT4 with a 6.2 is only 9200lbs conventional as I mentioned already.

I'd get that camper scaled before you spend a single dollar on a truck. "Probably 7000lbs" isn't good enough. Equip it exactly as if you were going camping and weigh it. I'm quite confident that you will be overweight either from the trailer, or if the trailer is just under, you will exceed payload with or without additional occupants/gear.

Remington92 · September 23, 2019

Dang ok, don’t take this wrong but is 5th wheel half ton towing all a marketing line? I can’t imagine there’s many 5th wheels smaller than this one.

NeverCold · September 23, 2019

33 minutes ago, Remington92 said:

Dang ok, don’t take this wrong but is 5th wheel half ton towing all a marketing line? I can’t imagine there’s many 5th wheels smaller than this one.

Based on your tag and the picture, that is definitely a tiny 5th wheel. But you're already at ~850 lb. for the pin weight which is 1/2 the payload of the LT Trail Boss above, and assuming that a 1500 6.2L AT4 is lower payload, you're starting to get into any trouble. Trailer + 4 adults and you're maxed on payload right there.

My opinion, yes, 5th wheel towing is a load of marketing BS when it comes to 1/2 ton trucks.

newdude · September 23, 2019

38 minutes ago, Remington92 said:

Dang ok, don’t take this wrong but is 5th wheel half ton towing all a marketing line? I can’t imagine there’s many 5th wheels smaller than this one.

So per this, your trailer can't exceed 6754lbs. Dry weight, your hitch weight is 834lbs. You'd have to keep the loaded hitch weight at or within a smidge of whatever the door tag has. So if its 1095lbs, you'd have to keep it at or less than that loaded weight.

An NHT max trailer 1/2 ton would be a much safer option over the offroad oriented AT4. You'd have some more payload cushion with NHT and you can still get the 6.2. An NHT equipped truck typically payloads 1900-2100lbs depending on equipment on the truck. Again, GM prints the door tag labels now so that would be the most accurate measure of the capability of a specific truck.

Edited September 23, 2019 by newdude

Remington92 · September 23, 2019

Alright I guess I’m giving up the skids but would an NHT 6.2 with a level and decent tires get me back semi to where I was with the at4 kind of best of both worlds? For driving farmers fields I liked the height and tires of the at4 over standard

redwngr · September 23, 2019

Have you tried airing down the 3500's tires (when not towing) to see if it will give a ride you'd find acceptable?

If looking at 1500's, the NHT package will give about 400 lbs higher payload, and will increase the tow rating ---but NHT is not available on AT4 or Denali (SLE, Elevation and SLT only)

Edited September 23, 2019 by redwngr

bshort · September 23, 2019

3 hours ago, Remington92 said:

Dang ok, don’t take this wrong but is 5th wheel half ton towing all a marketing line? I can’t imagine there’s many 5th wheels smaller than this one.

Those are "dry" weights also. No stuff, water, propane or batteries.

If the water is in the rear, you can fill it and offset some of the pin weight. The 5th wheel hitch alone is 100+ pounds.

Dpach · September 23, 2019

From the trailer tag, it looks to be running a 20% pin weight (gross dry and hitch dry weights). So if you ever load it near the GVWR max loaded rating of 6754 lbs, it will have a 1350lb pin which only leaves 200-300 lbs of payload left, which isn't enough for you, family, things in the truck, weight of 5th wheel hitch, etc.

It isn't hard to add 1000 lbs to an empty trailer if you carry extra propane tanks, coolers, ice, full freezer/fridge, all pots/pans, bedding, and daily supplies. Even at this (5350 lbs loaded area), you'd have a pin weight of 1070 lbs, which again only leaves 500-600 lbs for everything and everyone else. Less the weight of the 5th wheel in the back of the box, and you'd be very close with just 2 people.

The 5th wheel being half-ton towable sales pitch is just that. Trailer sales people love to say that, because they also quote dry weights so they can sell you a bigger camper for more $$ and let you worry about legalities. There is the odd small ultra-light 5th wheels that are only 20 ft long total and are now in the 3000 lbs range which would be ok with a half ton, but those are bare bones units.