If you only were going to be allowed one truck.....

aseibel · February 1, 2018

Though I would choose a regular cab square body based on looks alone, if I was to play along with your thought experiment: I would probably take the most modern truck I could get, in a crew cab. But a stripped down WT model without all the extra electronics that will be obsolete by the next presidential term.

As I do now, I only do mods that make it more useful for me, not for looks. Keeping as much stock as possible and of course treating her gently!

KARNUT · February 1, 2018

If the choice was total transportation car or truck. My answer would be 69 Chevy caprice 427 4 speed.

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Grumpy Bear · February 1, 2018

2 hours ago, aseibel said:

Though I would choose a regular cab square body based on looks alone, if I was to play along with your thought experiment: I would probably take the most modern truck I could get, in a crew cab. But a stripped down WT model without all the extra electronics that will be obsolete by the next presidential term.

As I do now, I only do mods that make it more useful for me, not for looks. Keeping as much stock as possible and of course treating her gently!

I love my 2015. It's been pretty solid so far and gave this allot of thought when I drafted my selection. I remembered some early experiences in my driving career; some in cars, some on bikes. I compared them to my later experiences and didn't like what I saw.

I know this is a fools ramble so save your tomatoes.

If you drive until your say 90 like my father still is and you buy this truck at 20 that's 70 years of driving. Of that the last thirty will be with fewer financial resources than you had when you were 10 foot tall and bullet proof and your mortality hadn't tapped you on the head yet. Your energy and strength wane. At 20 thousand miles a year, a bit less than my life time average that's 1.4 MILLION miles. At 90 dad can sill drop a transmission or change a clutch in the old iron at home. This was common once. Today it's hard to find a shop anyone can trust to rebuild our wonder boxes. Takes quite an education and allot of very expensive tools to do it.

70 years is a long time to keep a frame and body. The seat you sit on. All that plastic????

It's going to take more than "I'll change oil more often" to make this happen. It's going to take a commitment to skills people much younger than myself never learned and the teachers a dying breed. New trucks are not built to maintain your loyalty. Their built to take your money. Make you dependent and begging. I can weld a zipper in a cast iron block and rebuild the old 292 at home. I have no idea what is going to happen to modern castings of exotics or compacted graphite blocks.

It isn't the miles that will get you, it's time. It's hard to think of a time when you look back and find that one in a hundred of your great plans for your future self's well being were torn from your hands and feed to the wolves. It's easy to believe you have your bases covered, until they are not.

It's just not a question that can be fixed with, "Oh, I'll just go get more".

Edited February 1, 2018 by Grumpy Bear

aseibel · February 1, 2018

16 minutes ago, Grumpy Bear said:

It isn't the miles that will get you, it's time.

Grumpy Bear, I love your philosophical look at truck ownership I think anyone today will admit there is no way these current vehicles will last 70 years with the seats and plastic trim intact. We are in a throwaway society. We are lucky if we get 10 trouble-free years out of a vehicle. Maybe 20 years if a person takes "good" care of it. In Wisconsin, you can't make a frame last that long if you drive at all in the winter months.

Having a classic vehicle where everything was mechanical would be easier to fix, but you still have the issue of all the wearables and getting parts that would be approaching 100 years old. To play this game you would have to presume the structure of the vehicle can last that long.

So while your thought experiment is fun to think about, I know it could never really happen, no matter how often I change the oil.

Grumpy Bear · February 2, 2018

20 hours ago, aseibel said:

Grumpy Bear, I love your philosophical look at truck ownership I think anyone today will admit there is no way these current vehicles will last 70 years with the seats and plastic trim intact. We are in a throwaway society. We are lucky if we get 10 trouble-free years out of a vehicle. Maybe 20 years if a person takes "good" care of it. In Wisconsin, you can't make a frame last that long if you drive at all in the winter months.

Having a classic vehicle where everything was mechanical would be easier to fix, but you still have the issue of all the wearables and getting parts that would be approaching 100 years old. To play this game you would have to presume the structure of the vehicle can last that long.

So while your thought experiment is fun to think about, I know it could never really happen, no matter how often I change the oil.

Tell what got this started. An Uncle passed who still owned and used on farm his first ever truck. A 32 Ford pickup. 221 CID V8 flathead. Bob dairy farmed and ran the buss garage for the school district and his son taught auto shop there and worked in the garage as well. Obviously it wasn't new when he bought it being born in 22 but it was a local family owned truck with a known history.

Bob's heart was really bad the last five years and the motor was pulled from the truck and put on a stand at the school for display in the auto shop. Reinstalled for auction when he passed. That truck served him his entire life time and when sold had over one million miles on it still running with exactly one motor rebuild and still able to take feed to the cows or run a errand to town. Start on the coldest days.

Yes he had others in later years that got more service but still. Over 80 years of service to the family. It had been all over the USA but mainly within a few hundred miles of the farm. Pulled horse trailers to county fairs they rode in. Pulled a plow a time or two. Was the family car for over ten years. It did what needed doing in a time when parts were scarce. Post depression and WWII. What they couldn't find they made or adapted until they could. In 2012 most parts were still available. Still are actually.

I agree. I doubt anything made today could last as along and I agree it is a throw away society. Isn't that sad? I remember people chanting 'saving the planet for our children'. Yet never wavering coarse like the Titanic toward the greed iceberg straight to the waste of this throw away society.

There was nothing special about that 32 Ford. What was special was the family that maintained it and treated it like it was the only thing they would ever own in a time that was certainly possible. It isn't a matter of can it be done. It's already been done. Many times with many families. It was how they lived then. They worked hard and cherished the fruit of that labor. When my mother passed going threw her things we re-found her war stamp books. Sugar allotments. Gas, Tires, Coffee. Still unused. I asked her about that when I was younger. "Why would I take from those in greater need things I didn't"?

What do you think causes more pollution and waste more resources? Millions of dirty cars on the road or the manufacture of billions more than ever needed to be made? Cows fart more pollution that motor vehicles. That truck went low ball to a scrap dealer who crushed it. There are some sick people on this planet. I'd a got another 20 out of her.

Edited February 2, 2018 by Grumpy Bear

Grumpy Bear · February 3, 2018

So...having taken that a bit to far.

I ask again. If you had to make whatever choice you made last a lifetime how would you go about it? Remember, it's not just your transport, it's you only transport.

Grumpy Bear · February 5, 2018

I’m a bit confused. Members in general seem to be interested in the things that one would consider if they were attempting to make something last. Then do everything in their power to hinder the process. That’s very baffling.

Guys spend tens of thousands of dollars buying it. Thousands more modifying it. Obsess over the warranty then trade them like baseball cards. Complain about what junk they are then…go out and buy another because the next great thing just came out on an ever more complicated truck that will last an even shorter period of time than the one they just traded. They were dissatisfied with what they had due to issues they won’t address without GM footing the bill and didn’t uncover test driving it long enough or under a range of conditions comprehensive enough to uncover and more often than not, create from neglect, ignorance or abuse. The kicker? They decidedly didn’t understand the one they sold and bought one with more just to say they have more? More what? Problems!

Owners drop a few grand on lighting, tires, wheels and tunes and CAI’s then complain about the cost of a decent oil filter. Wrangle the prices of sellers new take offs like they didn’t have two pennies to rub together then dump hundreds into chrome or color matching do-dads on EBay then try to get 20K from an oil change.

What I am not confused about is the actual machine’s we drive. I actually like machines. They make sense. Used and driven within their designs and limits even junk designs are fairly reliable. I’ve owned a fair number of English war and post war motorcycles and routinely ride them trouble free in a crowd of guys that can’t get one around the block. These fellows are the first to tell me what can’t be done after I’ve done it. I’m not confused about that either.

You’re expecting it to be better than it is doesn’t make it so. Complaining about it won’t make it better no matter how many forums you joint or how much consensus you build. What you like and think about that hasn’t one bit of bearing on what it is. I’m not confused about that hence I have very few problems so common to others.

I don’t have a need to discuss it. Just thought it might be of interest of some others. I’m no longer confused about that either.

sdeeter19555 · February 5, 2018

I’m a bit confused. Members in general seem to be interested in the things that one would consider if they were attempting to make something last. Then do everything in their power to hinder the process. That’s very baffling.

Guys spend tens of thousands of dollars buying it. Thousands more modifying it. Obsess over the warranty then trade them like baseball cards. Complain about what junk they are then…go out and buy another because the next great thing just came out on an ever more complicated truck that will last an even shorter period of time than the one they just traded. They were dissatisfied with what they had due to issues they won’t address without GM footing the bill and didn’t uncover test driving it long enough or under a range of conditions comprehensive enough to uncover and more often than not, create from neglect, ignorance or abuse. The kicker? They decidedly didn’t understand the one they sold and bought one with more just to say they have more? More what? Problems!

Owners drop a few grand on lighting, tires, wheels and tunes and CAI’s then complain about the cost of a decent oil filter. Wrangle the prices of sellers new take offs like they didn’t have two pennies to rub together then dump hundreds into chrome or color matching do-dads on EBay then try to get 20K from an oil change.

What I am not confused about is the actual machine’s we drive. I actually like machines. They make sense. Used and driven within their designs and limits even junk designs are fairly reliable. I’ve owned a fair number of English war and post war motorcycles and routinely ride them trouble free in a crowd of guys that can’t get one around the block. These fellows are the first to tell me what can’t be done after I’ve done it. I’m not confused about that either.

You’re expecting it to be better than it is doesn’t make it so. Complaining about it won’t make it better no matter how many forums you joint or how much consensus you build. What you like and think about that hasn’t one bit of bearing on what it is. I’m not confused about that hence I have very few problems so common to others.

I don’t have a need to discuss it. Just thought it might be of interest of some others. I’m no longer confused about that either.

I was there for my last couple trucks...300k miles on several of them, ran aftermarket fuel systems, bypass oil filters, changed fluids like I had stock in OPEC. The last one I had over $10k in mods (and only one you could really see driving down the road)...I didn't want that again. My mods were always for reliability and fuel mileage, rarely cosmetic.

This one I decided I wasn't going that route, all those preventative maintenance items only benefit the next owner. I do still oil undercoat, I do still change fluids ahead of schedule, but I don't stress over the little things. Hind sight is always 20/20, I wouldn't have even bought my catch can...which is probably the biggest mod I've done on this truck.

Steve
2012 2500hd 6.0l

KARNUT · February 5, 2018

One of the amusing things about reading some of these threads is the lengths people go for longevity. The mods I do are for my amusement, not to make my vehicles last longer for the next guy. Very few people keep their rides more than 150K. There’s very little maintenance needed to go that long. What seems to end it for most vehicles these days is electronics and the dreaded check engine light. Most vehicles still will run fine with the light on, but you can’t get through inspection. Usually to turn the light off cost more than the poor third owner can afford. They go to the cheap car lots buy another car and pay by the week. You’ll see the ads,car runs great sell cheap just has the check engine light on.

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Grumpy Bear · February 5, 2018

10 hours ago, sdeeter19555 said:

I was there for my last couple trucks...300k miles on several of them, ran aftermarket fuel systems, bypass oil filters, changed fluids like I had stock in OPEC. The last one I had over $10k in mods (and only one you could really see driving down the road)...I didn't want that again. My mods were always for reliability and fuel mileage, rarely cosmetic.

This one I decided I wasn't going that route, all those preventative maintenance items only benefit the next owner. I do still oil undercoat, I do still change fluids ahead of schedule, but I don't stress over the little things. Hind sight is always 20/20, I wouldn't have even bought my catch can...which is probably the biggest mod I've done on this truck.

Steve
2012 2500hd 6.0l

10 hours ago, KARNUT said:

One of the amusing things about reading some of these threads is the lengths people go for longevity. The mods I do are for my amusement, not to make my vehicles last longer for the next guy. Very few people keep their rides more than 150K. There’s very little maintenance needed to go that long. What seems to end it for most vehicles these days is electronics and the dreaded check engine light. Most vehicles still will run fine with the light on, but you can’t get through inspection. Usually to turn the light off cost more than the poor third owner can afford. They go to the cheap car lots buy another car and pay by the week. You’ll see the ads,car runs great sell cheap just has the check engine light on.

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IF you were only going to be allowed one truck.....

That's the name of this thread. This idea that cost of repair is 'greater' than the 'value' of the truck may find roots in reality. But what isn't true is that the cost of those repairs will ever be greater than the cost of a new truck. That is pure fiction. Anyone that believes this isn't counting past the sticker price. If that were remotely true then things like the 'Great Depression' could have in fact never happened.

KARNUT · February 6, 2018

IF you were only going to be allowed one truck.....

That's the name of this thread. This idea that cost of repair is 'greater' than the 'value' of the truck may find roots in reality. But what isn't true is that the cost of those repairs will ever be greater than the cost of a new truck. That is pure fiction. Anyone that believes this isn't counting past the sticker price. If that were remotely true then things like the 'Great Depression' could have in fact never happened.

Most people don’t save their money. Once their payment is completed saving the payment for repairs would be the next move. Doesn’t happen, from the tote your note lot to the new car dealership usually at the first sign of trouble they get traded in. Just check the average age of cars on the road.

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Grumpy Bear · February 6, 2018

11 minutes ago, KARNUT said:

Most people don’t save their money. Once their payment is completed saving the payment for repairs would be the next move. Doesn’t happen, from the tote your note lot to the new car dealership usually at the first sign of trouble they get traded in. Just check the average age of cars on the road.

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Stan in my heart of hearts I know you are right. Sill what is done isn't what can be done and that's the part I'm after. What people do is kind'a like the old saying, "Everyone want's to go to heaven. No one wants to die". No matter how much sense a thing makes most have trouble making sense of it. This thread is suppose to be light and fun, not like trip to the dentist. Work with a brother and tell your best 'make it live forever' stories, tips and tricks.

Imcrazy · February 6, 2018

Nice thought but, they don't make trucks that last much longer than 10-15 years up here in the salt covered north.... If I had to just have one truck that would last forever... I'd get a 2500 HD GMC Sierra Denali 4x4 crew cab 5-1/2 ft bed with a duramax... If I had to pick a truck to keep for 10 years I'd get a GMC Seirra or Chevy Silverado 1500 crew cab 5.3 4x4 SLT or LTZ....

Coby7 · February 6, 2018

I've only owned GMs and one Suzuki. If I were to have my wish I'd have to say my first pick-up was the nicest and the envy of all my friends ( 1948 Chevrolet 5 window ) . If I were to change things it would have had a V8 and a 4 speed with same Ivory ball long stem shifter on the floor instead of the 262 straight 6 and a 3 speed on the floor. I'd take it the same color too, navy blue..

Edited February 6, 2018 by Coby7

Grumpy Bear · February 6, 2018

1 hour ago, Imcrazy said:

Nice thought but, they don't make trucks that last much longer than 10-15 years up here in the salt covered north.... If I had to just have one truck that would last forever... I'd get a 2500 HD GMC Sierra Denali 4x4 crew cab 5-1/2 ft bed with a duramax... If I had to pick a truck to keep for 10 years I'd get a GMC Seirra or Chevy Silverado 1500 crew cab 5.3 4x4 SLT or LTZ....

I agreed to that already. What is was designed to do isn't the question. Making it do what it wasn't is.