2016 GMC 2500 6.0

royg6677 · September 3, 2017

I started towing a 5th wheel camper and experience a jerking in the truck in any gear above 3rd gear and between 2200 rpm and a little above 3000 rpm. If I manually down shift causing rpm to be above 3200 rpm and above it will stop jerking. I took truck to dealer with camper attached and duplicated jerking in the above mentioned rpm range, he had computer connected to truck and when he unlocked converter jerking stopped. He locked converter and jerking started again within the 2200-3000 range. GM and he does not think it is a converter is the problem still waiting for them to contact me. Has anyone had a similar problem and what was the resolve?

4wdriver · September 7, 2017

Yes you have described it perfectly however I have not had it addressed yet. It is less noticeable under no load but still feel it some. The load from having the air conditioner on will cause this in my truck as well. Hope they find the problem on your truck it might help me to.

Motor City Rick · September 7, 2017

Red Rider 2016,

Couple of questions, how heavy is your 5th wheel fully loaded with stuff and liquids (how many gallons of liquid)??? How fast are you going when the bucking / jerking starts??? That is a very critical question.

You do understand, when the torque converter is locked up, it's a mechanical direct connection in the complete driveline???

When the torque convertor is not engaged it's a fluid dampening situation in the driveline???

This problem has be present all GM vehicles since 1980 for the jerking sensation.

The problem is the ECM has no clue your pulling 10,000 pounds of stuff behind you. Can't compensate with variable loads and road conditions outside it's "load map".

One of the "corrective fixes" since 1980 for this issue was to install a torque convertor shut off / or trick switch with Weather Pack terminals to eliminate torque convertor lockup under heavy load usage.

Knowing that, ...shutting off the torque convertor solenoid with an open will generate a trouble code. Resistance values have to be right on or codes will be present. You have to get another exact torque convertor clutch solenoid wired in parallel (placed in a protective box) to trick the ECM engagement signal. When you have a double pole double throw (DPDT) switch, you are switching from trans torque convertor clutch solenoid in the trans to the do nothing trans torque convertor clutch solenoid inside a box returning a phony engagement signal. A "very skilled" electrical technician will know the concept / strategy.

Dealer with poo poo this idea. But when the dealer is lost for solutions, think about this fix.

grizzlyltz · September 7, 2017

That weird

I have a 15 2500 6.0 and have no jerking at all

I'm pulling a 5er around 12000 lbs , there's no need to add a valve to fool the ECM

Try another dealer

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

TRKLGND · September 8, 2017

That weird

I have a 15 2500 6.0 and have no jerking at all

I'm pulling a 5er around 12000 lbs , there's no need to add a valve to fool the ECM

Try another dealer

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

What he said!

My TT is 10,600 and my boat is about 5k. No jerking at all.

royg6677 · September 8, 2017

Motor City Rick

Camper loaded the way I am towing about 11200 lb I do not have any fluid in my tanks.

What speed---It depends in what gear the truck is in. It does not happen at any certain speed. 2000 rpm everything ok in any gear from 3rd on at about 2200 on up jerking starts stops jerking at about 3200 rpm in the same gear you are in. On a level road on light acceleration increasing speed no jerking as soon as I reach around 2200 rpm it starts to jerk. Hope I answered your question I hope that I do not have to do what you are saying will fix this condition

Motor City Rick · September 9, 2017

Red Rider,

Your rated tow capacity for your truck is "claimed" to be 13,000 pounds. That's 85.15% of "maximum" load that you are stating excluding wind resistance driving above 55 mph, which even adds more of a load. Being that high, I wonder if the ECM performance map is at it's limits at your tow configuration??? When you buy any vehicle for towing, you want to keep your load demands less than 50% of rated capacity just in case you have to drive into a mountain / high altitude situation.

For years I've seen people claiming their pulling 12,000 of stuff with their big block macho anythings, but the truck is rated for 8500 pounds towing. Then cry when something fails on their truck because it was "overloaded" from the get go. There is way more than just tow weight.

Now to the diagnosis.

When the jerking starts, "lightly" press your foot on the brake pedal to move the pedal, but not enough to slow down the truck. Did the jerking stop?

The people "making comparisons" to their vehicles have to remember each vehicle has it's own software map inside the ECM as to the output functions (torque convertor clutch). There are performance calculations for every input sensor to make a collaborative decision what to do with vehicle load and transmission function.

Another area that people forget is trailer weight can be exactly the same, but if there is a strong have head wind (like driving 70 instead of 55 mph), slight hill inclination, or less aerodynamic trailer, that increases drag which is not added in the ECM calculation.

2016HD · September 9, 2017

Motor city Rick. He is not explaining the problem as drive line slop. What he is explaining will not be caused just buy towing a trailer and excess weight. Sounds like the TCM needs a reprogram or update as its Locking and unlocking the converter in those rpms while under load.. The truck is designed to tow what he is towing without issue. As with most of us we do not have this problem.

However with the newer variable cam timing and the transmission programming in the new trucks i can see where this issue could arise if the TCM and ecm are not cooperating properly. Torque converter lock and unlock and cam phase adjustments all happening at the same time causing a jerking or hesitation etc.

Pretty sure its a tcm or programming problem. Not because he is towing a trailer. Most of us know what a trailer feels like while its being towed with the backlassh between hitch and truck etc.

grizzlyltz · September 9, 2017

Red Rider,

Your rated tow capacity for your truck is "claimed" to be 13,000 pounds. That's 85.15% of "maximum" load that you are stating excluding wind resistance driving above 55 mph, which even adds more of a load. Being that high, I wonder if the ECM performance map is at it's limits at your tow configuration??? When you buy any vehicle for towing, you want to keep your load demands less than 50% of rated capacity just in case you have to drive into a mountain / high altitude situation.

For years I've seen people claiming their pulling 12,000 of stuff with their big block macho anythings, but the truck is rated for 8500 pounds towing. Then cry when something fails on their truck because it was "overloaded" from the get go. There is way more than just tow weight.

Now to the diagnosis.

When the jerking starts, "lightly" press your foot on the brake pedal to move the pedal, but not enough to slow down the truck. Did the jerking stop?

The people "making comparisons" to their vehicles have to remember each vehicle has it's own software map inside the ECM as to the output functions (torque convertor clutch). There are performance calculations for every input sensor to make a collaborative decision what to do with vehicle load and transmission function.

Another area that people forget is trailer weight can be exactly the same, but if there is a strong have head wind (like driving 70 instead of 55 mph), slight hill inclination, or less aerodynamic trailer, that increases drag which is not added in the ECM calculation.

His truck is rated to pull

Conventional trailer - 13000

Fifth wheel-14000

He is not over loaded and should pull with no problem

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

TRKLGND · September 9, 2017

His truck is rated to pull

Conventional trailer - 13000

Fifth wheel-14000

He is not over loaded and should pull with no problem

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Motor City Rick is way off base. By his logic, the average 1/2 ton can't pull my pontoon. Being conservative is one thing, that's just foolish.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-T817A using Tapatalk

4wdriver · September 10, 2017

Not to mention as I stated above my truck does this under lighter loads at the same rpm as his like when air conditioning is running or towing or hauling. It even does it sometimes just going up hill. I have to get my oil changed soon and I will ask about updates. Red rider can you tell me more about your truck mine is a crew cab LT with a 6.0 not sure on build date also has plow package.

fjtort2 · September 10, 2017

My 15 6.0 used to jerk at lower speeds/ taking off from a stop/ taking turns while towing 8,000lbs every once in a while... A custom tune solved most of my issues. The jerking is gone now

Motor City Rick · September 10, 2017

2016HD, ...Agreed. From the information so far from Red Rider 2016, he's describing TCC kick in and kick out issues, not drive line slop. Like I said earlier, this problem has been around since 1980. I agree his truck needs a reprogram of the performance map when pulling at 85.15% of full load, I can agree that TCM / ECM adjustments have to be made.

Now for all the critics. I stated one line everybody skipped over: "The people "making comparisons" to their vehicles have to remember each vehicle has it's own software map inside the ECM as to the output functions (torque convertor clutch)". Unless you have the exact same year/ model / motor / trans / rear axle and tow weight (with air drag), your comparing walnuts to oranges.

grizzlylyltz, Please show me that fact (reference) where the tow load is 13,000 for a trailer and 14,000 for a fifth wheel??? Did you get your fact from the manufacturer or some other source?

paracutin, pontoon's are lighter than any fifth wheel (along with additional items stored for travel), though pontoons have less aerodynamic drag at 55 to 70 mph. than the big panel of an aluminum fifth wheel behind the truck.

I need to know where I'm "foolish" in my statements??? Being in central Illinois and not in the Detroit area, what is your vehicle manufacturer diagnostic experience??? Dealt with any complex driveability problems??? What is you knowledge of the 5 coefficients of drag on Red Rider's 2016 truck??? Let's see your diagnostic judgement???

grizzlyltz · September 10, 2017

2016HD, ...Agreed. From the information so far from Red Rider 2016, he's describing TCC kick in and kick out issues, not drive line slop. Like I said earlier, this problem has been around since 1980. I agree his truck needs a reprogram of the performance map when pulling at 85.15% of full load, I can agree that TCM / ECM adjustments have to be made.

Now for all the critics. I stated one line everybody skipped over: "The people "making comparisons" to their vehicles have to remember each vehicle has it's own software map inside the ECM as to the output functions (torque convertor clutch)". Unless you have the exact same year/ model / motor / trans / rear axle and tow weight (with air drag), your comparing walnuts to oranges.

grizzlylyltz, Please show me that fact (reference) where the tow load is 13,000 for a trailer and 14,000 for a fifth wheel??? Did you get your fact from the manufacturer or some other source?

paracutin, pontoon's are lighter than any fifth wheel (along with additional items stored for travel), though pontoons have less aerodynamic drag at 55 to 70 mph. than the big panel of an aluminum fifth wheel behind the truck.

I need to know where I'm "foolish" in my statements??? Being in central Illinois and not in the Detroit area, what is your vehicle manufacturer diagnostic experience??? Dealt with any complex driveability problems??? What is you knowledge of the 5 coefficients of drag on Red Rider's 2016 truck??? Let's see your diagnostic judgement???

Not sure why you want me to prove my statement

Look it up your self!!

It's in the owners manual

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

TRKLGND · September 11, 2017

2016HD, ...Agreed. From the information so far from Red Rider 2016, he's describing TCC kick in and kick out issues, not drive line slop. Like I said earlier, this problem has been around since 1980. I agree his truck needs a reprogram of the performance map when pulling at 85.15% of full load, I can agree that TCM / ECM adjustments have to be made.

Now for all the critics. I stated one line everybody skipped over: "The people "making comparisons" to their vehicles have to remember each vehicle has it's own software map inside the ECM as to the output functions (torque convertor clutch)". Unless you have the exact same year/ model / motor / trans / rear axle and tow weight (with air drag), your comparing walnuts to oranges.

grizzlylyltz, Please show me that fact (reference) where the tow load is 13,000 for a trailer and 14,000 for a fifth wheel??? Did you get your fact from the manufacturer or some other source?

paracutin, pontoon's are lighter than any fifth wheel (along with additional items stored for travel), though pontoons have less aerodynamic drag at 55 to 70 mph. than the big panel of an aluminum fifth wheel behind the truck.

I need to know where I'm "foolish" in my statements??? Being in central Illinois and not in the Detroit area, what is your vehicle manufacturer diagnostic experience??? Dealt with any complex driveability problems??? What is you knowledge of the 5 coefficients of drag on Red Rider's 2016 truck??? Let's see your diagnostic judgement???

The statement I had issue with is... "When you buy any vehicle for towing, you want to keep your load demands less than 50% of rated capacity just in case you have to drive into a mountain / high altitude situation."

It is patently false. It is simply your opinion, to which you are entitled but should Not represent it as fact. Not a single manufacturer supports your statement. If they did, they would list tow ratings with a disclaimer.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-T817A using Tapatalk