A/C Condenser

Spurshot · July 12, 2017

add me to this sh!t list.

A/C has been struggling getting worse here in houston over the last few days. Called my dealership. They wanted $126-something to diagnose, said it would go towards repairs tho. I asked if its worse case scenario and is the condenser, how long and how much? they said $1200 and a month or two wait. FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK THAT NOISE.

of course yesterday it is really struggling, so i went and looked all over for a leak. pretty sure it is my condenser, because it has an oily, wet stain on the driver-side near the top braze spot.

I was able to find a $199 Tough-One brand replacement condenser at an Advance Auto around here. But i will say these things are slim pickins around here. i had to try 3 places before i lucked into that one.

question i have is: after condenser replacement... if i pull a vacuum on this thing, how much PAG 46 oil will i need to add back into the system before i refill with r134a? the Advance Auto computer says 7.1 oz needed total, but i have read people saying you add only 2 if you replace the condenser? whats the right number? if you pull a vacuum, won't all of the oil be removed as well?

SCHOOL ME PLEASE.

If you need help, PM me. I'm no expert, but I've gone thru this and other AC issues over the years and have been servicing my own systems for about 10 years now. Of course, you should have a good set of gauges/hoses, a good AC vacuum pump, a thermometer, a can tap, and a digital kitchen scale, as a minimum. That's a few hundred dollars worth of equipment as a minimum. But it'll pay back over the years. I recommend Robinair equipment.

Edited July 12, 2017 by spurshot

Snoringbear · July 13, 2017

I bought a 2017 sierra put 2000km on it then hit a deer. Fml I know.

It has been in the body shop for a month now and they have not started fixing it because the condenser is still on backorder with no ETA. Any thoughts if I should try and find an aftermarket one? I have a rental for the time being but insurance only covers that for so long. Cant be without a truck months on end waiting for this condenser. Any thoughts on getting one fast so they start fixing my truck?

Thanks

Apparently this is not warranty work? If not, I think I would consider just going with a after market condenser. My service rep where my truck is sitting called me yesterday. She still didn't know when the dealership would receive a shipment of condensers but did say they've been getting some in every month. I asked how many trucks are sitting on the back lot waiting on condensers? She stated that she had my truck and one other but didn't know about the other reps. Appears the service dept has about six service reps. So, guessing there's at least a dozen or so trucks waiting on condensers. Btw, I brought up the possibility of using an aftermarket condenser. She stated that if I chose that route I would have to pay for the job as it would not be covered by warranty. So, being my truck is still under warranty and I have a loaner, think I'll just cool my jets for while and see what happens...

Snoringbear · July 13, 2017

Just sitting here noodling; I think that if my truck was out of warranty I would pull the condenser and see if they could repair it. A condenser is basically a radiator and methods to repair one should apply to the other I would think. Anyway, seems it would be worth the time to ask.

Snoringbear · July 13, 2017

Just sitting here noodling; I think that if my truck was out of warranty I would pull the condenser and see if they could repair it. A condenser is basically a radiator and methods to repair one should apply to the other I would think. Anyway, seems it would be worth the time to ask.

Amendment: "see if a radiator shop could repair my condenser"

spectaculous · July 13, 2017

If you need help, PM me. I'm no expert, but I've gone thru this and other AC issues over the years and have been servicing my own systems for about 10 years now. Of course, you should have a good set of gauges/hoses, a good AC vacuum pump, a thermometer, a can tap, and a digital kitchen scale, as a minimum. That's a few hundred dollars worth of equipment as a minimum. But it'll pay back over the years. I recommend Robinair equipment.

I appreciate your offer! and i may just call on you when i get going on it if i run into any problems.

I bought a harbor freight (i know. i know.) manifold gauge set and 2.5 cfm vacuum pump the other day. I figure if i can get one use out of it, i've gotten my money's worth. I've got the thermometer (thermopen) and digital scale already. just need to get a can tap.

didn't you replace your high and low pressure side lines/hoses? what are the part numbers on those? i might go ahead and change mine out too, to be safe...

i have been adding freon every 3 or so days to stay cool until i can find a free saturday to do all of this. i am assuming i will need to either let it fully leak out the current way it is doing on its own or i will need pull it all out with a reclamation tank before i begin breaking any connections, right?

Spurshot · July 13, 2017

I appreciate your offer! and i may just call on you when i get going on it if i run into any problems.

I bought a harbor freight (i know. i know.) manifold gauge set and 2.5 cfm vacuum pump the other day. I figure if i can get one use out of it, i've gotten my money's worth. I've got the thermometer (thermopen) and digital scale already. just need to get a can tap.

didn't you replace your high and low pressure side lines/hoses? what are the part numbers on those? i might go ahead and change mine out too, to be safe...

i have been adding freon every 3 or so days to stay cool until i can find a free saturday to do all of this. i am assuming i will need to either let it fully leak out the current way it is doing on its own or i will need pull it all out with a reclamation tank before i begin breaking any connections, right?

I did replace my lines. I think I bought them all at GMPartsGiant.com. Either them or GMPartsDirect.com. Just plug in your model data and it'll lead you to the parts. Get the stabilizing bracket as well.

As to whether to reclaim the Freon, the law says you can't vent it. But if it leaks out on its own, you're good to go.

spectaculous · July 16, 2017

just tackled this sh!t today. good god, it didn't go nearly as smooth as the YouTube video made me think it would. 8 or 9 hours. with some healthy breaks mixed in there.

fingers crossed that it is leak free. I really don't feel like tearing it all back apart to fix it if it isn't good...

Spurshot · July 16, 2017

just tackled this sh!t today. good god, it didn't go nearly as smooth as the YouTube video made me think it would. 8 or 9 hours. with some healthy breaks mixed in there.

fingers crossed that it is leak free. I really don't feel like tearing it all back apart to fix it if it isn't good...

Sorry to hear that. I didn't encounter any problems. In fact I did remove it, check it and reinstalled the bad one when I couldn't locate one, just so I could drive the truck. Once I got a condenser I had to do it all again.

Did you charge the system yet?

spectaculous · July 16, 2017

Did you charge the system yet?

I did. I pulled vacuum for 15 minutes then closed all the manifold valves and waited another 15 minutes to see if it held vacuum. The gauge appeared to move ever so slightly off the 29/30 inches it started with. So I repeated the process again to see if my eyes were seeing things. They saw slight needle movement again.

I definitely could see the leak spot on the old condenser I pulled. So I figured the only place I could have a legitimate leak is on the refrigerant connections to the condenser when I hooked it back up. I gave it my best effort to tighten that 13mm nut down. I really couldn't make it any tighter that it was, so I thought that maybe it is that harbor freight manifold gauge set could've been leaking. I tightened the 6 connections on it the best I could when I put it together but I decided not to wrap the threads with Teflon tape. Maybe I had a leak on those connections or my eyes were not in the exact same spot to reread after 15 minutes.

You can probably guess where this story is headed-- I finally said f*ck it" and continued pulling vacuum on the system for an hour or so while i reinstalled the parts I had removed to get access. Added PAG 46 oil. I think it might've been 2 oz. Then I added what I thought was 22 oz of r134a. AC was nice and freezing last night and this morning, so now I play the waiting game for the next couple of weeks or so to see if I my system is leak free.

What should the high and low side pressures be if I have the proper amount of freon?

Dnt · July 16, 2017

I would not get to excited about a slight rise in vacuum on your test. It is likely that you have some moisture in the system. If there is moisture it will continue to boil off and make the pressure a bit lower. The way you can tell if it is moisture is if the vacuum level drops and then "stops" moving. Say you get to 29.9 hg and shut everything down and come back in an hour and it is on 28,5 well check it in another hour and if it has not moved you just need to continue vacuuming the system to remove the moisture. May have to do that a few times if you did not replace the accumulator (filter drier) you might never get ALL the moisture out! I have used a heat gun on the accumulator before to raise the temp to encourage moisture evacuation when in a pinch when I could not get a replacement filter drier on an older vehicle. Like spurshot said nothing really all that complicated with AC work but it does take some rather expensive and single use type tools.....If really get into it you will want to get a flow guage/tank of nitrogen/bottle cart/electronic refrigerant leak detector/recovery system/micron gauge/oxy acy torch set etc etc etc I would really be afraid to add up all the specialty tools and supplies that I have out in my work shop (afraid the wife would find out how much I spent LOL) Gear up man it is going to be a Hot Summer...................just cut out beer and cigs for a few months and you can save enough to buy all this stuff. R143A automotive will run around 35 on low side and around 250 (dependent upon ambient temp) high side. To properly test pressures though there is a procedure to use they mean nothing if not tested properly JSYK

spectaculous · July 17, 2017

May have to do that a few times if you did not replace the accumulator (filter drier)

I tried to buy a new dryer, but advance Auto said it was integrated with the condenser, so I hope it was in there.

Thanks for the knowledge! I didn't think about the residual moisture may have raised the pressure slightly like that. That's probably what it was.

I want to say I was near 35 psig on the low side when I stopped. I know it was at least 30 psig and was definitely not 40 psig. The can weight loss accounting wasn't nearly as easy to figure out while I was in the middle of it all. I weighed a 12 oz can of freon as 15.something oz on the scale and then by the time I weighed it during charging, I had added the can tap and the weight of the yellow hose was added. I just kept adding each can until it felt empty and had no feel of liquid sloshing around. When I closed the valves and removed the empty can, it too a sec or two to depressurize, so I figured at most was an ounce of gas left or it was the low side system pressure. At worst, I added 24 oz instead of 22 oz...

Spurshot · July 17, 2017

As Daryl pointed out, the rise in pressure can be from moisture. But it can also be from air in the oil. If the system is at ambient pressure, air molecules wedge into the oil until it becomes saturated. You can't see the air, but it's there. When you pull a vacuum on the oil, the air want to come out. The oil will appear to boil, releasing the air. We used to degas oil we used under vacuum in the nuc biz. We had a big diameter pot like container with a flange and o ring and we put a thick clear acrylic top on it. We vacuumed it down. It would boil for hours. When it stopped boiling it was free of air.

System operating pressures vary widely due to condenser air flow temps. You can google R134a pressure tables. You should put a big fan in front of the condenser to make it a more correct test. A big window fan works fine. R134a is very reactive to temperatures. In fact, I do my charging with the aid of hot water in a pot. As the system is filled, it slows to accepting more freon. I put the can in the hot water for a few seconds at a time, checking weight of the can as I go. Pressure in the canjumps dramatically when dipped in hot water and you have to be careful not to over pressure the can.

Edited July 17, 2017 by spurshot

spectaculous · July 20, 2017

I am coming up on my 5th full day since i replaced the condenser, and its looking like i won this one. AC is still blowing cold and easily can handle the heat Houston is throwing at it.

One other question, i forgot to ask: did any of you replace the dexron VI you lost from the condenser change? how much do i need to add back to the transmission?

Spurshot · July 21, 2017

I am coming up on my 5th full day since i replaced the condenser, and its looking like i won this one. AC is still blowing cold and easily can handle the heat Houston is throwing at it.

One other question, i forgot to ask: did any of you replace the dexron VI you lost from the condenser change? how much do i need to add back to the transmission?

Congrats on the successful replacement and servicing.

About the trans fluid. I probably didn't lose but maybe a few ounces, pulling it out and draining it twice. Frankly, it was so little, I didn't check it. Probably should, now that you mention it.

Edited July 21, 2017 by spurshot

jonesumd · July 28, 2017

I'm in the same boat with the faulty AC condenser. After 4 attempts to fix it at my dealer, I finally called GM to complain and they gave me the same BS answer of no ETA on the re-designed condenser. I'm sick of this being the 5th time getting fixed (and that's if it really gets fixed this time).

This is my first new American vehicle purchase and I can say with confidence I will never buy American again. I know that might piss some off but I've owned Nissan, Honda, Suzuki, and Toyota and have never had a major issue with any of them. With a $50K+ purchase (more than any new vehicle I've ever bought), I expect it to work.

I went to CarMax yesterday to see what they'd give me for my 2016 SLT Crew Cab with only 2,800 miles on it (mint condition). I told them the AC doesn't work and they didn't care as long as it's under warranty. They only offered me $41,000 for it. While they were evaluating my truck, I test drove a 2016 Nissan Titan XD Diesel. It was very nice and if they offered me $43-44K, I would have immediately traded it in for the Titan. The pathetic part is I can't even do a private sale of my truck until the AC is fixed which from what others are reporting could be 2+ months.

I'll probably wait for the fixed AC and then immediately sell it and buy a used Titan.

Edited July 29, 2017 by jonesumd