6.2 with afe intake = 36hp!

evilstevie · January 28, 2017

Two points on this.

1) Regarding a vested interest: Might be worth looking into margins on the performance parts industry. If we were to see one intake sale per day, every day for a year, it would cover salary for one employee for less then a month. This is not now and will not ever be a significant portion of our revenue.

2) Regarding air not being a limiting reagent: Air is the ONLY limited factor in engine performance in this discussion. Fuel and ignition timing are easily adjustable and controlled, however both of those variables will only allow you to extract the maximum performance relative to the number of oxygen molecules. A 10% increase in air into the combustion chamber will yield just slightly less than a 10% increase in power.

2) This is an NA motor, so it pulls in air via vacuum as a result of the combustion cycle. Increasing the amount of available air, even by a tremendous amount, isn't going to change the amount of air that's pulled into the combustion chamber, unless this air is being forced in via FI. CAI's are not superchargers. Is the stock air box so tremendously restricted that it's not actually getting the air that it can use? Seems unlikely to me but anything is possible.

truckguy82 · January 28, 2017

2) This is an NA motor, so it pulls in air via vacuum as a result of the combustion cycle. Increasing the amount of available air, even by a tremendous amount, isn't going to change the amount of air that's pulled into the combustion chamber, unless this air is being forced in via FI. CAI's are not superchargers. Is the stock air box so tremendously restricted that it's not actually getting the air that it can use? Seems unlikely to me but anything is possible.

Exactly why I talked about the additional vacuum reading earlier in the thread.

GMC_SD_Ult_16 · January 28, 2017

Exactly why I talked about the additional vacuum reading earlier in the thread.

Truck guy 82,

Can you repost the vacuum difference to clarify your point that the airbox is that restricted? If I remember it showed stock box amounts vs putting on the CAI. Thanks.

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truckguy82 · January 29, 2017

Truck guy 82,

Can you repost the vacuum difference to clarify your point that the airbox is that restricted? If I remember it showed stock box amounts vs putting on the CAI. Thanks.

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JonA recorded it and posted it in this thread

http://www.gm-trucks.com/forums/topic/194700-intake-manifold-swap/page-1

truckguy82 · January 29, 2017

I stated the data pertained to the air intake system. Attached you will find a scan from a stock Camaro on the dyno. If you look at the MAP values, you can see it only pulls 3-3.5 kPa of vacuum from beginning to ~6K RPM, depending upon the exact RPM ranges over which you take your averages. That's as good as the trucks will do with an aftermarket CAI. With the stock system, the trucks will pull 5.5-6 kPa of vacuum.

1300c · January 29, 2017

-We have 1 dyno from a company that sells CAI's. No offense but not exactly unbiased.

-It is clearly not the same exact engine. Cam, intake, exhuast, tune, etc. are different.

-all motors make power with bolt ons. Typically very little from a CAI and no tune

No opinion on your last two points.

These CAI vendors and manufacturers obviously have a vested interest in posting big hp gains. A truly scientific test would attempt to explain the results, using other data, and not just throw things on a dyno and report the numbers. GM probably has 1000000x the R+D budget of all of these CAI manufacturers combined, so it seems a bit absurd that such a hp gain would be possible. Especially in light of the fact that the new ecoboost now out torgues the 6.2. Wouldn't now be the time for GM to "remove the restriction" and reclaim bragging rights for power, if they were in fact intentionally throttling back the 6.2? Air is not the limiting reagent in combustion chemistry, so increasing available air by 10% or 1000% isn't going to make a lick of difference in hp. But it will sell a lot of CAI's.....

Have you cross referenced part #'s on the internal engine parts? Everything internally on the l86, and lt1 are the same according to the part #'s supplied for both engines.

truckguy82 · January 29, 2017

Have you cross referenced part #'s on the internal engine parts? Everything internally on the l86, and lt1 are the same according to the part #'s supplied for both engines.

they are the same, he has no idea what he's talking about

TheGovernment · January 29, 2017

In case anyone cares, I spoke to AFE yesterday, they won't be releasing CAIs for the 17s till late spring, early summer.

shift_grind · January 29, 2017

2) This is an NA motor, so it pulls in air via vacuum as a result of the combustion cycle. Increasing the amount of available air, even by a tremendous amount, isn't going to change the amount of air that's pulled into the combustion chamber, unless this air is being forced in via FI. CAI's are not superchargers. Is the stock air box so tremendously restricted that it's not actually getting the air that it can use? Seems unlikely to me but anything is possible.

The combustion cycle is a fixed amount of time depending on the rpm. The more air it can suck in, the more power it will make. If it didn't, putting a 1" intake tube on wouldn't reduce power.

polarisnchevy · January 29, 2017

I just installed the afe momentum on my 2017 5.3 this afternoon. Was talking with afe before ordering and they said to see if it fits and if it didn't they would take back and pay for shipping. No fitment issues during install.

15_silverado · January 30, 2017

I just installed the afe momentum on my 2017 5.3 this afternoon. Was talking with afe before ordering and they said to see if it fits and if it didn't they would take back and pay for shipping. No fitment issues during install.

Was that the same model used in the black bear test?

What's the part number?

Also how does it sound on the 5.3

polarisnchevy · January 30, 2017

I got the dry filter, the test used the oiled filter. The part number for dry is 51-74104. Have only driven around the block so I will have to tell you tomorrow.

MIDNITEZ71 · January 30, 2017

I got the dry filter, the test used the oiled filter. The part number for dry is 51-74104. Have only driven around the block so I will have to tell you tomorrow.

post some pics please

evilstevie · January 30, 2017

Have you cross referenced part #'s on the internal engine parts? Everything internally on the l86, and lt1 are the same according to the part #'s supplied for both engines.

Cam is the same apparently. Intake, exhaust, tune are the only differences between LT1 and L86.

The combustion cycle is a fixed amount of time depending on the rpm. The more air it can suck in, the more power it will make. If it didn't, putting a 1" intake tube on wouldn't reduce power.

Right. But it's not going to suck in more air than it's capably of using just because the air is there. Obviously a 1" intake tube wouldn't flow nearly enough air. Conversely, if "more air" was always the answer, all manufacturers would have a giant 3 foot diameter orifice at the front of all of their intakes, with a screen on the front to keep out birds. And those BS K+N demos claiming "3x more air flow!" would have really yeilded their advertised +30 hp on every single car ever made instead of jack squat. Typically, CAI's without a tune make minimal hp gains. This has been proven time and time again with various dyno tests over the years. Throw a tune on and they typically add a handful of hp. Apparently one out of this bunch was able to add 25 hp without a tune. That is certainly not typical. I missed the point about the vacuum mentioned earlier so I'll have to go see if a logical explanation was included.

Edited January 30, 2017 by evilstevie

truckguy82 · January 30, 2017

Cam is the same apparently. Intake, exhaust, tune are the only differences between LT1 and L86.

Right. But it's not going to suck in more air than it's capably of using just because the air is there. Obviously a 1" intake tube wouldn't flow nearly enough air. Conversely, if "more air" was always the answer, all manufacturers would have a giant 3 foot diameter orifice at the front of all of their intakes, with a screen on the front to keep out birds. And those BS K+N demos claiming "3x more air flow!" would have really yeilded their advertised +30 hp on every single car ever made instead of jack squat. Typically, CAI's without a tune make minimal hp gains. This has been proven time and time again with various dyno tests over the years. Throw a tune on and they typically add a handful of hp. Apparently one out of this bunch was able to add 25 hp without a tune. That is certainly not typical. I missed the point about the vacuum mentioned earlier so I'll have to go see if a logical explanation was included.

Yes more air actually is always the answer, welcome to internal combustion engines