Rust Bucket Engineering.

[Grumpy Bear]

This is a Subaru Outback but it wouldn’t matter. This problem is common as dirt. They ALL do this, foreign and domestic. Doesn’t matter if you paid $15K or a $150K. It doesn’t matter how much due diligence the owner puts forth. If it has a rubber bumper it will rot here. If it’s a truck it will be a cab corner or the height of the wheel arch. It isn’t a new problem. In fact in recent years this problem that use to take perhaps a decade to show itself can be devastating in what, two years. (i.e. Dodge Trucks). Worse is deliberate. Downright evil IMHO.

 

The price has tripled and quadrupled on some vehicles and we have more new space age tech than one can dream and the only way to keep this from happening is keep it in the garage on anything but the sunniest day?

 

I’m not impressed. What kind of company can be proud of its technology that can’t cure this SIMPLE common problem. Go ahead auto industry. Tell us how smart you are. How advanced your technology is.

 

 

If it were a brand or a mark within a brand it would be different. It’s past a problem. It’s become a way of business.

 

 

 

 

[DeePa]

I feel that state and town dot are more pressured to get down to pavement asap. Salt usage has increased I'm sure.

 

Sheet metal is thinner to save weight for mpgs.

 

Paint is thinner for EPA.

 

Etc.

[pickmeup]

Rust is a auto makers best friend. For those low mileage drivers out their that could easily get 25 years out of vehicle mechanically. Yes they could except for good old rust . These new frames rust a nice glowing orange . Happy Halloween! Quick Martha grab the checkbook and we going to trade this rust bucket before it rots in half and drops like a sick cow.

[barry G]

I have an 87 subaru, more than 50 pounds of mig weld.

the sheet added up is two pieces of plywood for reference in sqaure yards.

 

I broke the rear end for the 7 th time in november.

 

it is way overpowered by its own engine , I took the runt away..

that is asking for trouble anyway.

when you can't use a factory clutch anymore.. you know you are in trouble.

 

rust is cathode/anode. If the pH of real world was enough to rot steel by itself, we'd all die of hydrochloric acid poison.

 

electrical monsters is the culprit. Nothing more than that.. unless an outright hazardous accident.

 

from 96 onward some may have noticed the bodies lasting a freakishly long time.

they have true regulation in the electric.

 

 

I go further, because I am a nerd. Half wave (diode) and LED is incredible. Modern relays electronic with their own sense of what is needed is just another one.

Since the dawn of stainless steel cords in heavy duty tires..that is another body keeper. Earth ground loves them, as well as alloy wheels on all iron trucks.

not a coincidence to find them looking good for a longer time.

 

some paints, like KBS and whatever else truckers use on frame rails.. good stuff.

keep a good ear to these chores.. some of it does work.

 

 

 

attaching lipstick to a pig fixes nothing, you gotta get to the root of the killer.

[diyer2]

I wonder about you barry g.

[Grumpy Bear]

Y’all make'n my point. Tis preventable, curable and the causes are known and addressable. Thanks Barry.

 

Currently most dealers will sell a lifetime power train warranty for a few thou IF I let the assigned dealer do ALL maintenance. Not likely. And…not likely I would not buy such a package for a car where there will be nothing left to bolt anything to before the payment book is cleared.

 

Sell you paint protection to. Stuff they say in bullet proof. That’s a thou or better.

 

You can have it rust proofed…maybe. Undercoated. IF you can find some who will actually apply it instead of just take your money.

 

Isn’t this called racketeering?

 

I don’t need lane departure until I have something that can leave the garage.

[Colossus]

One never knows if a solvent of some sort gets poured onto a vehicle which causes rapid paint and metal degradation but the owner may think it is a result of poor build quality. I don't know. I'm just as angry at anyone else when rust or fade or something else shows up after all the time and effort we may put in to making something last and be clean.

[It's Tim]

Car washes make a mint during the Winter with their "stop the rust" sales pitches. Usually no one would even consider spending money getting a vehicle washed when it's filthy again 10 minutes later. Vehicles made of metal rust (salt or not) it's just fact of life. Plastic vehicles aren't real big on sales.

[Grumpy Bear]

Think!

 

There is no way electricity can know where on a vehicle to attack. This fender seem doesn’t’ say “come here little electrons”.

Coatings abound that prevent rust. Cosmoline wax that actually conforms to Military Standard MIL-C-11796C Class in example. This paraffin used now is not that.

 

Rust prevention is the purpose of coatings. Zinc chromate. Galvanizing. Higher nickel content steels. Alloy. Stainless. Carbon Fiber. Fluid bed powder coatings. Dialectic coatings used in commercial electric motors. Flash nickel plate. Alloy weight wasn’t the only reason Ford went to it.

 

The solvents removed in recent years wasn’t the component nor the mechanism that prevented rust. They were carriers.

Proper prep helps. Acid etching and neutralization. Proper seam construction. Seam sealing period. There’s a thought.

 

Decent design that favors longevity over eye candy although both, as I’ve said before, can live quite nicely together.

 

Window glass seals. OMG. There is no reason with today’s tech that these should be an useless afterthought. Hatchback. Trunk. Tailgates. Swiss cheese construction.

 

Take about $3K in useless ego-tech out of a car and apply it toward something that actually is consumer pocket book useful.

 

Put a pocket rocket car on a lift and really look at it. You can count dozens of improvements that would benefit the car and its owner that can be totally funded from not funding the intentional destructive design that is incorporated. It is DESIGNED to fail.

 

Think. Toyota is replacing frames under warranty that have rusted though. Coatings was the issue. Proper ones not applied.

 

Now put your $60K truck on the rack and observe. Looks just like the toy car above.

 

They will spend $$$$ on your ego because you’re willing to repay that 30:1. They will build a wind tunnel and spend millions on aero to meet some government standard for fuel. Billions have been spent on smog. Brute force. There is no cost they will not bare to save the company an penny. But there is no reason for them to spend a dime that prevents them from selling you your next car/truck buy making the last one last longer.

 

Why? Because you will do just that. No matter how bad it gets you will continue to buy and buy an buy and eat on a spoon these ridiculous excuses and marketing ploys. You will continue to make excuses for them. This is preventable.

 

When I was young a factory exhaust system lasted about two years. Today I have them on my Honda’s lasting 20. Not coatings. Just the right material for the job. Just an example showing it can be done by the willing.

[It's Tim]

True, but in your example apparently the plastic trim vibrated to such an extent that a hole was worn into the protective coating exposing the bare metal.

[sdeeter19555]

I feel that state and town dot are more pressured to get down to pavement asap. Salt usage has increased I'm sure.

 

Sheet metal is thinner to save weight for mpgs.

 

Paint is thinner for EPA.

 

Etc.

Insurance drives it...insurance also drives the states to cut trees way back from the edge of the highways...

 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk

[sdeeter19555]

As for the Ford comment, I can't wait to see how well aluminum holds up against salt...I've seen aluminum parts and pieces on OTR trucks corroded through just like steel.

 

Another thought is that the "salt" they use today isn't the same as they used, plus they spray the roads with brine. You probably would find less salt in ocean water. Keep in mind also that the days of salt are coming to an end...they are now realizing the effects of salt use and the environment. A couple years ago, they used so much salt in SE PA that the DRINKING WATER in became salty to the taste!

 

As far as the electrical thoughts...anyone remember the electrical gizmos you could buy to prevent rust by providing a sacrificial anode?

 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk

[Grumpy Bear]

The choices are not one or the other. iron or plastic. Ever see a DeLorean rust? How about a Corvette? Nash Healy? Austin? Lola? Kaiser Darrin? Briggs Cunningham? Lotus? Not all of these were top tier cars costing a king’s ransom. The Kaiser beat the Corvette in 53 by a month of being the first glass car produced in volume. A Henry J in sportswear.

 

Besides alternative materials that are not plastic are COATINGS. You see for metal to rust it has to have a oxygen supply. Fluid bed powder coatings and electrostatic dipping. Bonding. This isn’t a new thing that takes millions to develop. The tech is there. In use everywhere. Well sorted and with the adultery level of the auto market today they all have access and have it now. Bury it in salt if it's coated right.

 

Everyone acts like Ford Trucks are the cherry for alloy bodies. Far from it. The English beat them by a hundred plus years.

 

When I was a child a fellow at church bought a new 62 Impala. His grandson has it today having over a half million miles on it. Original mechanicals are long gone for this three generation daily driver but the body and paint and frame are not. One of the first Ziebart applications I ever knew about. Boyd kept it up. It was his shop so it was applied as it should have been. If a Iowa pig farmer can do it Detroit can too.

 

It isn’t rocket science. It just takes will. It’s already paid for.

[Marticus]

The choices are not one or the other. iron or plastic. Ever see a DeLorean rust? How about a Corvette? Nash Healy? Austin? Lola? Kaiser Darrin? Briggs Cunningham? Lotus? Not all of these were top tier cars costing a king’s ransom. The Kaiser beat the Corvette in 53 by a month of being the first glass car produced in volume. A Henry J in sportswear.

 

Besides alternative materials that are not plastic are COATINGS. You see for metal to rust it has to have a oxygen supply. Fluid bed powder coatings and electrostatic dipping. Bonding. This isn’t a new thing that takes millions to develop. The tech is there. In use everywhere. Well sorted and with the adultery level of the auto market today they all have access and have it now. Bury it in salt if it's coated right.

 

Everyone acts like Ford Trucks are the cherry for alloy bodies. Far from it. The English beat them by a hundred plus years.

 

When I was a child a fellow at church bought a new 62 Impala. His grandson has it today having over a half million miles on it. Original mechanicals are long gone for this three generation daily driver but the body and paint and frame are not. One of the first Ziebart applications I ever knew about. Boyd kept it up. It was his shop so it was applied as it should have been. If a Iowa pig farmer can do it Detroit can too.

 

It isn’t rocket science. It just takes will. It’s already paid for.

I'm not sure which one of your examples I like the most. How many blood vessels have you popped over this? Have you every really looked at a Corvette? I can tell you for a fact that the metal structure under the glass does rust like all vehicles. Sounds like you should sell the vehicles and take the bus. Or move to Arizona....

 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk

[Jsdirt]

My Volvo 940 is a prime example of what GOOD rust proofing is. Copper-nickel alloy brake lines ... FROM THE FACTORY. Imagine that! Took GM 20 years to finally start attempting to keep them longer than 2 years, by coating them with plastic (nylon). Copper-nickel is too good! Can't have that now ...

 

That Volvo has spent every single one of it's 23 years in New England, and there isn't a SINGLE rust spot on the body. Even the undercarriage is in really good shape. Not perfect, but 1,000% better than any Ford, Chrysler, or GM product - any of those that have been driven more than 12 years up here are already in the junkyard.

 

The little Volvo might be down on power, and not the most stylish thing on the road, but at least it was built with PRIDE. Something that ALL automakers in the 21st century have long since forgotten. This one was engineered to LAST. Too bad even today's Volvo is a pile of dung - nowhere near what it used to be.