V6 in CC 4x4 with full size bed?

Brian S. · February 15, 2017

Steve, there's a difference in actually "doing things" and reading about them or watching videos.

For example, my 16' Old Town canoe is Royalex, not exactly a rigid material. (but light and strong, ideal for my uses) With the tailgate down, I can angle the canoe to the back drivers corner of the bed and have more than half the canoe flat in the bed, and not sticking out past the edge of my truck.

My jon boat can barely fit between the wheel wells.

I would have needed a long bed (extra cost) Colorado to even fit the ice shanty and motorcycle. OSB isn't laying flat in a Colorado bed.

The Colorado is a narrower vehicle and the bed is smaller.

While I'm sure you read a lot about using trucks, doing it is another matter.

It's amazing to me you have the balls to actually try to tell people what trucks to buy when you don't seem to have much if any experience with what people buy trucks for.

It's one thing to tell people what kind of mileage you get or why you like the fake leather seats, but to tell people who actually do haul, tow, go off road what they need to do it when you're a city guy hauling groceries and maybe some mulch on weekends is stupefying.

sdeeter19555 · February 15, 2017

Dang, have any of you ever been married? I never considered buying a camper, but the wife wanted one and we bought a 24 ft. I was happy in a tent...

Sometimes things aren't planned and you run what you brung...then upgraded later down the road as time, money, and necessity dictate. I started out mowing three acres of grass with a 14hp 40-inch deck tractor, I now mow it with a 25hp 61-inch mower...did the 14hp cut the grass, absolutely; just not as fast. If it's within your truck's capacity, then what's the question?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk

Silverado Steve · February 15, 2017

Brian,

Let's try to be rationale here and keep the rhetoric out of the conversation....deal? I'm not telling anyone what truck to buy, merely I am pointing out that the argument that most people don't tow over 4K pounds...fact, most people drive around with an unloaded truck 95% of the time...fact....most people drive a vehicle, truck, car or SUV with only themselves or one passenger, 90% of the time...fact. With those fact presented, and with the argument you have made time and time again that a 4.3 is all most full size owners ever need, then the argument that a mid size is truly all of a truck most owners ever need has to be strongly considered based on why they still make them. Also, it is debatable that a full size truck is safer in a crash, in fact the Tacoma and GM twins actually earned better crash ratings of the full size sans the F-150. So the question is how often do most people haul plywood? I moved sheets of plywood, firewood, furniture just fine in my 5 ft bed Tacoma. your response that you would need a 6ft bed midsize doesn't make any sense, that's why they offer that. If your need exceeds your truck needs and you buy plywood once a year, Home Depot and Lowes can deliver, and even then you can rent a full size for those few times you need really big objects. Those are facts of 95% of truck owners not Brian S. You need to quit asserting you personal needs as the basis of this argument. Now, if you're like most full size buyers, and you buy a truck for those few times you truly need the capability, I have to ask, why would you not opt for the 5.3 engine at $750 which amounts to $15 more a month over a 5 year loan, and the gas mileage difference negligible? The fact is there, is no reason....its been debated and factually there is no real benefit to the 4.3, hence why only 18% of sales equals the 4.3 and most of those are fleet. These reasons purely negate most if not all the points you previously made that a 4.3 is ample and a better buy. Now if you were debating the 4,3 versus the 6.2, you might have some valid points. There's a reason Ford is reintroducing the Ranger and why GM reintroduced the midsize 2 years ago. More and more people who realize that a full size is too much, would rather buy something that is easier to park in an urban environment or their garage and get better mpgs. As I said earlier, the Ford 2.7 really blows the 4.3 out of the water, price wise, mpg wise and power wise. Again I will say this, the only rationale reason to purchase the 4.3 today is you are squeezing yourself into a 1500. nothing more, nothing less.

Steve, there's a difference in actually "doing things" and reading about them or watching videos.

For example, my 16' Old Town canoe is Royalex, not exactly a rigid material. (but light and strong, ideal for my uses) With the tailgate down, I can angle the canoe to the back drivers corner of the bed and have more than half the canoe flat in the bed, and not sticking out past the edge of my truck.

My jon boat can barely fit between the wheel wells.

I would have needed a long bed (extra cost) Colorado to even fit the ice shanty and motorcycle. OSB isn't laying flat in a Colorado bed.

The Colorado is a narrower vehicle and the bed is smaller.

While I'm sure you read a lot about using trucks, doing it is another matter.

It's amazing to me you have the balls to actually try to tell people what trucks to buy when you don't seem to have much if any experience with what people buy trucks for.

It's one thing to tell people what kind of mileage you get or why you like the fake leather seats, but to tell people who actually do haul, tow, go off road what they need to do it when you're a city guy hauling groceries and maybe some mulch on weekends is stupefying.

KARNUT · February 15, 2017

Good point I stated moving my equipment in the 80s with a one ton, my combo was 25K lbs. The first truck was a refurbished 73 390 ford that was highly modified. The trick I learned real quick was the trailer and it's brakes and how you load the equipment. No truck is going to safely stop a trailer that can't stop its own load, that's more important than the tow rig.

Donstar · February 15, 2017

I seem to remember test driving a V6 with a brake controller in 2015 but I don't see it as a separate item on the website for 2017. I received the "electric brake lead" with my truck. With respect to the reasons for buying a V6, I wanted and limited my search to a V6. My first "mod" was to find a V6 badge for my truck. I actually wanted the large OEM red, white and chrome side badges found on the 60's 1/2 tons. There wasn't enough flat fender space to follow through with this plan! I appreciate any money saved up front may be reflected in a corresponding lower trade-in value. I thoroughly enjoy driving a full sized pickup as my main form of transportation. The V6 gets me to my destination as quick as a V8 would and if I save a buck or two on a fill up of gas, or go a little further on a tank, this is a bonus. I don't see a purpose in speculating why a person would choose a particular engine size.

Silverado Steve · February 15, 2017

I think it is well discussed that it does make sense, financially and capability wise in regards to the 4.3 over the 5.3 with the 3.08, but seeing how GM doesn't charge to upgrade to the 3.42. I think you are the outlier in that you only wanted a 4.3. The only reason for this dialogue is the question posed by the OP. At the end of the day, your money, your decision, but for the sake of discussion and why it makes sense to buy a V6, there are far more reasons not to than to. We can agree to disagree I guess, but again for discussion sakes, there are plenty of facts that don't support the economics of buying the 4.3...again all for discussion sake.

I seem to remember test driving a V6 with a brake controller in 2015 but I don't see it as a separate item on the website for 2017. I received the "electric brake lead" with my truck. With respect to the reasons for buying a V6, I wanted and limited my search to a V6. My first "mod" was to find a V6 badge for my truck. I actually wanted the large OEM red, white and chrome side badges found on the 60's 1/2 tons. There wasn't enough flat fender space to follow through with this plan! I appreciate any money saved up front may be reflected in a corresponding lower trade-in value. I thoroughly enjoy driving a full sized pickup as my main form of transportation. The V6 gets me to my destination as quick as a V8 would and if I save a buck or two on a fill up of gas, or go a little further on a tank, this is a bonus. I don't see a purpose in speculating why a person would choose a particular engine size.

Donstar · February 15, 2017

I think it is well discussed that it does make sense, financially and capability wise in regards to the 4.3 over the 5.3 with the 3.08, but seeing how GM doesn't charge to upgrade to the 3.42. I think you are the outlier in that you only wanted a 4.3. The only reason for this dialogue is the question posed by the OP. At the end of the day, your money, your decision, but for the sake of discussion and why it makes sense to buy a V6, there are far more reasons not to than to. We can agree to disagree I guess, but again for discussion sakes, there are plenty of facts that don't support the economics of buying the 4.3...again all for discussion sake.

No need to disagree! You chose a silver truck, I chose a brown truck. Others even pay more for an upgraded paint! Choice is wonderful!

Brian S. · February 16, 2017

LOL! I think you honestly believe you can prove that no one should buy a full size V6 over a mid size truck Steve.

You just don't get it on the hauling. You say my needs are unique, but around the Midwest, guys with a full sized bed stuffed with ice fishing gear, hunting gear, water craft, an ATV, a snowmobile, dirt bike(s) and the like isn't hard to do. We recreate OUTDOORS.

How many times do I haul plywood? Between duck blinds, repairs to sheds, screen porch and roof repairs at backwoods cabin- more often than you think I do.

Like I've told you all along: I use a truck like a truck, and want a full size truck.

I got a good deal on that 4.3l and think that is the reason to buy one. I have no doubt a person can deal them down a thousand or two more on them, as you say, demand is not as high.

Is that "the poor man's argument"? Could be "the smart man's argument" in my opinion. Payment amount means NOTHING. It's still $1000-$2000 off cash price, plus cost of interest, plus 1.5mpg less for life of vehicle, plus lower car insurance. Easily $3000 -$4000 over life of vehicle.

And no, some of us don't want F150 2.7ls. A. Been a GM guy my whole life B. Auto 4wd FTW, only on high trim lines Ford C. Why don't YOU buy one of those tiny boosted engines and check out the longevity? Me, I'd take the 4.3l any day.

Brian S. · February 16, 2017

Brian,

Let's try to be rationale here and keep the rhetoric out of the conversation....deal? I'm not telling anyone what truck to buy, merely I am pointing out that the argument that most people don't tow over 4K pounds...fact, most people drive around with an unloaded truck 95% of the time...fact....most people drive a vehicle, truck, car or SUV with only themselves or one passenger, 90% of the time...fact. With those fact presented, and with the argument you have made time and time again that a 4.3 is all most full size owners ever need, then the argument that a mid size is truly all of a truck most owners ever need has to be strongly considered based on why they still make them. Also, it is debatable that a full size truck is safer in a crash, in fact the Tacoma and GM twins actually earned better crash ratings of the full size sans the F-150. So the question is how often do most people haul plywood? I moved sheets of plywood, firewood, furniture just fine in my 5 ft bed Tacoma. your response that you would need a 6ft bed midsize doesn't make any sense, that's why they offer that. If your need exceeds your truck needs and you buy plywood once a year, Home Depot and Lowes can deliver, and even then you can rent a full size for those few times you need really big objects. Those are facts of 95% of truck owners not Brian S. You need to quit asserting you personal needs as the basis of this argument. Now, if you're like most full size buyers, and you buy a truck for those few times you truly need the capability, I have to ask, why would you not opt for the 5.3 engine at $750 which amounts to $15 more a month over a 5 year loan, and the gas mileage difference negligible? The fact is there, is no reason....its been debated and factually there is no real benefit to the 4.3, hence why only 18% of sales equals the 4.3 and most of those are fleet. These reasons purely negate most if not all the points you previously made that a 4.3 is ample and a better buy. Now if you were debating the 4,3 versus the 6.2, you might have some valid points. There's a reason Ford is reintroducing the Ranger and why GM reintroduced the midsize 2 years ago. More and more people who realize that a full size is too much, would rather buy something that is easier to park in an urban environment or their garage and get better mpgs. As I said earlier, the Ford 2.7 really blows the 4.3 out of the water, price wise, mpg wise and power wise. Again I will say this, the only rationale reason to purchase the 4.3 today is you are squeezing yourself into a 1500. nothing more, nothing less.

So if it is a "fact" 95% of people would be better served by a Taco (LOL) or a Colorado/Canyon, why do you think so many more people buy Silverado/Sierra, F150, and RAM? These are the three best selling vehicles, month after month, year after year.

http://gmauthority.com/blog/gm/chevrolet/colorado/chevrolet-colorado-sales-numbers/

108,725 Colorados sold last year.

http://gmauthority.com/blog/gm/chevrolet/silverado/chevrolet-silverado-sales-numbers/

574,876 Silverados sold last year.

So over 5 times as many people choose Silverados over Colorados even though the "fact" is 95% of them would be better off with a Colorado? LOL, I think you need to buy an ad during the next Superbowl Steve, apparently the vast majority of truck buyers are willing to spend more for the trucks, gas, and insurance to NOT drive mid size trucks.

Hmmm, remember how you always say there is less demand for 4.3s? Looks like there is 80% less demand for mid size as well.Do you think that helps your resale argument?

Silverado Steve · February 16, 2017

Very good question and i think thats the nut each manufacturer who builds trucks is trying to crack..i think GM has a good idea...any wonder why Ford decidd to reintroduce the Ranger when just two years ago Ford said..."no way". Part of the issue as others have mentioned is the price difference betwen the mid size or full size ot there lack of. One of the bets and issues manufacturers made was bumping up the size of what were compact truck to what is now midsize....the reason is bigger vehicles actually get a break in EPA standards versus theit compact counterparts. The marketing blip behind this is dealers know they can easily upsell someone looking at a midsize to a fullsize "i can put you in a 1500 for only a couple more $Ks"

Idealistically what should be looked at is how the midsizes do against their full size V6 lower/mid size trimmed counter parts. So if you use your tally of GM numbers and factor 16-18% of full size sales are 4.3 sales according to GM and compare that to midsize sales, the numbers dont look so outrageous now do they? 92,000 fullsize 4.3s versus 108,725 midsize. What the rest of full size sales say is people buy the biggest bang for the buck and high end trim full size trucks, supporting what I and others have been saying all along buyers realize that the 4.3 is not cost effective and will buy the 5.3 on up and that the vast majority of full suze buyers want a fully loaded, more capable and often luxury truck. This strategy commands transaction prices over $50K for the manufacturers. These are the manufacturers cash cows, they sell and they know customers will buy them. That effects resale of those who bought the 4.3 to save money..limited demand, limited want = lower resale.

What i find absolutely hilarious in this debate for all the reasons you will argue why it makes sense for most people to buy the 4.3 those same reasons you absolutely dis ount and discard on why a midsize makes sense for those same truck buyers. Again your situation is different than the 90% of truck buyers. We agree most people dont haul, tow or load their trucks to capacity...if were discussing the logic of buying strictly for need versus want, then a midsize makes as much if not more than any full size V8 truck fr the average consumer. That is all im am saying. I get im not going to convince you otherwise, but i think most people get what i am saying. For the same reasons kost people dont need a V8 most people dont need a full size in general.

So if it is a "fact" 95% of people would be better served by a Taco (LOL) or a Colorado/Canyon, why do you think so many more people buy Silverado/Sierra, F150, and RAM? These are the three best selling vehicles, month after month, year after year.

http://gmauthority.com/blog/gm/chevrolet/colorado/chevrolet-colorado-sales-numbers/

108,725 Colorados sold last year.

http://gmauthority.com/blog/gm/chevrolet/silverado/chevrolet-silverado-sales-numbers/

574,876 Silverados sold last year.

So over 5 times as many people choose Silverados over Colorados even though the "fact" is 95% of them would be better off with a Colorado? LOL, I think you need to buy an ad during the next Superbowl Steve, apparently the vast majority of truck buyers are willing to spend more for the trucks, gas, and insurance to NOT drive mid size trucks.

Hmmm, remember how you always say there is less demand for 4.3s? Looks like there is 80% less demand for mid size as well.Do you think that helps your resale argument?

Brian S. · February 16, 2017

Ah.

The marketing blip behind this is dealers know they can easily upsell someone looking at a midsize to a fullsize "i can put you in a 1500 for only a couple more $Ks"

So you admit that midsize trucks only sell less than a 4th of full size trucks, and that mid size trucks cost about the same as full size trucks (especially 4.3l full size trucks, and yet you think 95% of people would be better off with trucks that have less interior room, and less bed room?

Steve, my 2010 Silverado 5.3l had 315hp, 335ft lbs torque. On E85, my 2014 4.3l had 297hp/330ft lbs at the same RPMs. (and the mileage on E85 was pretty close, and offset by E85 usually being cheaper)

It was also probably faster than that 2010 5.3l:

http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2014-chevrolet-silverado-v-6-instrumented-test-review

This helped our V6 Silverado turn a quarter mile time of 15.7 seconds at 89mph. That's a tenth of a second faster than the 6.0-liter V8 "VortecMax" Silverado we tested back in 2007

It was only 3/10 of a second slower than the 2007 6l on regular gas, and that was only 7/10 of a second slower than the 2014 5.3l LTZ. So we're talking about 3mph slower in the quarter mile on E85, or 5mph slower than a LTZ 5.3l. Seriously, even if you use the most possible difference, is 87mph vs 92mph a big deal? (and I ran E85 a LOT, it's readily available here, and usually a good deal cheaper)

Your arguments just don't make much sense. The 4.3l 5th gen engine is pretty equivalent to the 5.3l 4th gen engines and those of us who had them (instead of Tacomas) we're shaking our fists at the sky daily yelling, "Why can't we have more hp and torque?!?".

KARNUT · February 16, 2017

Not to jump into this entertaining thread with good arguments on both sides. The deal breaker for me is sound, I didn't put exhaust on any of my V-6s. Both my V6s would hammer even the 6.2, different beast not a fair fight. I like my trucks to talk to me, nothing beats the V8 sound with tuned exhaust.

Silverado Steve · February 16, 2017

Brian, this is getting tiring and frankly, dig a little deeper in your understanding. I pointed out that if you compare a mid size Colorado Canyon to it's full size 4.3 comparison, the midsize outsells the 4.3. I never said a midsize outsells or comes close to the full size. Remember GM sells way more V8 trucks then the V6, why is that? Most trucks are driven unloaded and don't haul by 95% of their owners. What this means and what you fail to see even though it's been pointed out several times over now is, people are buying the midsize if their needs only require they tow >7000lbs, rarely haul large loads and mpgs are a factor which suits 95% of truck buyers. All of these arguments were the same ones you made on why people should consider the 4.3 over the 5.3. The other 80% of truck sales for the average buyers is for buyers like me, people who buy a full size who may not need a full size day to day, but may want that capability in the future...maybe a travel trailer, a toy hauler, boat or an enclosed trailer and also prefer the luxury and capability of a full size even though they may not haul 9,000 pounds on a regular basis. You can't get a 4,3 on an LTZ,, SLT, Denali or HC. Again, the stats prove that if people only need midsize capability, they are choosing a midsize truck over a full size truck that offers equal capability nothing less nothing more. Again, why would Ford reintroduce the Ranger if the midsize market is garbage when you can buy a V6 F-150? There is no further debate to this fact. So again I state that people who buy a full size truck will choose full size capability versus their true need or choose a midsize. The stats prove that. So you and Donstar are the outliers....there is little benefit overall to buying a 4.3 midsize unless overall cost is your main objective..and even with that fact in mind, most of the full makers offer a V8 across their lineups regardless of trims for a negligible upcharge...in GMs case it's $750, which factors into $18/mon over the course of a 60 month loan...hardly a disqualifier for most buyers looking at a $40K truck, and hardly a strong case of an economic benefit to choose the 4.3. Make sense now?

Ah.

So you admit that midsize trucks only sell less than a 4th of full size trucks, and that mid size trucks cost about the same as full size trucks (especially 4.3l full size trucks, and yet you think 95% of people would be better off with trucks that have less interior room, and less bed room?

Steve, my 2010 Silverado 5.3l had 315hp, 335ft lbs torque. On E85, my 2014 4.3l had 297hp/330ft lbs at the same RPMs. (and the mileage on E85 was pretty close, and offset by E85 usually being cheaper)

It was also probably faster than that 2010 5.3l:

http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2014-chevrolet-silverado-v-6-instrumented-test-review

It was only 3/10 of a second slower than the 2007 6l on regular gas, and that was only 7/10 of a second slower than the 2014 5.3l LTZ. So we're talking about 3mph slower in the quarter mile on E85, or 5mph slower than a LTZ 5.3l. Seriously, even if you use the most possible difference, is 87mph vs 92mph a big deal? (and I ran E85 a LOT, it's readily available here, and usually a good deal cheaper)

Your arguments just don't make much sense. The 4.3l 5th gen engine is pretty equivalent to the 5.3l 4th gen engines and those of us who had them (instead of Tacomas) we're shaking our fists at the sky daily yelling, "Why can't we have more hp and torque?!?".

mookdoc6 · February 16, 2017

My Chime Time!

You live in Nebraska your going to buy the 4.3L Full-Size

You live in San Francisco your going to buy the Colorado/canyon and deal with awkward bed width hauling 4x8's aka without modifying it to hold sheet rock and not crack it all up?

eventually the Colorado/canyon owner will just make due the bed limitations and occupancy limitations?

You get none of that with the Full-Size 4.3L

I have mentioned nothing about towing and don't need too!

As for the FERD 2.7........Honestly, you could offer that truck to me with more "TECH" at 3K less than a nicely reduced stripped down CHEVY with the 4.3 Ecotec and I would buy the Chevy 4.3 no doubt! Stick the 2.7 in you know where?

For the record I pull Jack nothing! I have for work and for decades couldn't even bring myself to driving a a "Truck" for personal use I lived in the godamn things for years.........arghhhhh.......Let's just say I have a quiet, smooth GMC now and don't drive trucks for a living anymore! Thank the Lord!

Donstar · February 16, 2017

What do you think about this particular model?

Oversized vehicle paired with an undermatched engine or unique combination of mpg and hauling capacity?

I am interested in ChevyV6's views on the responses to his question.- If you already own this configuration, does it meet your needs? If you are considering a purchase what are your thoughts?