'79 Chevy K10 as a daily driver?

m1tommy · March 7, 2003

Hello the group/forum,

I've asked one other old Chevy truck forum and most answeres were distressingly positive. If this is too long, my apologies.

I've just stumbled across a '79 Chevy K/10 LWB with 60k miles for $7,000 asking. The owner showed the truck the past few years, and it looks like a truck, just a solid truck. It's a "Scottsdale", a level above base model. It has floor liner (no carpet) w/ rubber floor mats ( a plus as far as I'm concerned), no A/C, PS, tilt wheel, "pulse" wipers (intermittent?), factory gages, and a very nice shell camper. In short it seems to be your basic truck. Not having A/C doesn't really bother me. I've had trucks w/out, before and view it as less to keep up. The photo's show the interior to be clean.... not perfect but clean and sound. There's one crack in the dash and one, 2" tear in the seat cloth. The truck photo's look like it could be sitting in a showroom, but I know that photo's are all in the "just detailed" state. The drive train is a factory stock 350/4bbl.

It has "full time 4WD", something I know almost nothing about. As the transfer case is a NP203, and is chain driven, does this chain have a life like a timing chain, about 70-80,000 miles? If so, what do replacements cost and how much work is it replacing it? Something about a chain driven drive unit in a truck on the highway seems to send up red flags to me. Are the rear wheels chain driven too? The truck's all original, but with only 60,250 miles. The owner has receipts and a well-documented owner's manual. It sounds like he has been pretty meticulous about regular maintenance, like changing oil every 3 months, whether driven much or not.

It was a "third vehicle" until he "did shows" with the truck. In '95, he replaced fenders, doors, rocker panels hood and entire bed box w/ GM panes... to "do shows". He owner replaced the body panels and bed with GM parts, and undercoated the all the back sides, and frame, then. Per the owner, he has driven or run the truck about monthly the past couple years, is about to retire and has too many vehicles nowadays. The owner (and truck) are several states away, but he has responded to all my questions and will photo. anything I ask about. He's already sent me detailed photo's of door rockers, tailgate, engine firewall area, lower edges of the doors, several of the one of the underbody (shows the transfer case w/ no dings or even scrapes) and edge of the tailgate area and about 50 others. All look sound and clean. He's been great at answereing the 8 or 9 emails full of whatever questions I can think up.

I can do simple mechanic work, change water pumps, radiators, wheel bearings, brakes, shocks, straight forward, unbolt, take apart, and put it back together work, but lots of gears and bearings befuddle me. Especially if its something that takes special tools (unless I can make them myself). Last week, I changed the oxygen sensor and flushed out the cooling system on the '89 Toyoyo, picking up a DMM to check the throttle positioning sensor is the next ditty planned. Electrical stuff past that completely befuddles me. Tell me a vehicle has a history of electrical problems and I won't get close to it! I understand and expect to replace some thingies, whatever a ham-fisted engineer can get hold of and turn, pull or prod. I have a decent set of basic tools, good jack, stands, a garage (that probably wouldn't close with this long-bed pickup).

My main use would be a daily driver, about 35 miles a day round trip, occasional hunting trips, a yearly long highway trip. I'd likely keep it stock.... unless it "needs" TBI.. 15 mpg would be nice. And yes, I'd take a hit w/ the gas, dropping from about 20-21 mpg w/ the Toyoyo to 15 or so w/ the Chevy truck... I'm an optimist, OK.... I work in a place as to where I can say that I don't see gas getting any cheaper soon, too. Other ideas are:

1) Worrying about driving through 6" water to/from work is getting OLD. Yeah, it rains something fierce in SE Texas!

2) I'm getting antsy seeing too many roads I can't "look-see" to and from work and miss just, "toodeling around".

3) And, I've 2 young boys... can't hardly take 'em camping w/ that little Toyoyo

What should I beware of, with this truck, or am I barking up the wrong tree even considering it? While I like tinkering, I do want a reliable truck & late night "....gotta fix this to get to work in the morning...." don't do much for me! Advice/opinions are appreciated. If this is the wrong place for this question, let me know.

And, I've never worked on a carburetor (sp?) before.. honest...... OK, you can laugh now.

Thanks for reading my rambling post.

Tommy

Torque Junkie · March 12, 2003

A classic truck can surely be used as a comfortable daily driver. A few of the members here do just that. Mine is used daily when the weather is too bad to drive my Camaro in (which is about half the year up herre in Montana).

However, some things to take into mind when comparing it to a simliarly priced later model truck.

First and most importantly; Safety: Older vehicles don't have near the safety features as newer ones. That vintage of GM trucks had the outside-the-frame mounted fuel tanks, which very easily ruptured when involved in a T-bone accident. Also, a 24 year old truck doesn't have airbags or high-back seats (which would help prevent whiplash if rear-ended). However.... older trucks are alot more solid than newer ones. They're heavier and have less plastic, so in a minor wreck, you should emerge the victor with minimal damage. Case in point - when my brother slid into me head-on on our driveway last winter at around 20 mph. He was in an 89 S-10 Blazer. I was in my 79 K-10. His Blazer sustained pretty substantial damage while my truck had only a bent bumper. Here are some pictures... http://www.redlineenterprises.com/crash

Transmission gearing: The truck either has a 3 speed automatic, or a 4 speed manual; neither of which have overdrive. Though, thats perfectly fine and was the norm 20+ years ago, by todays standards it's unacceptable. Take into consideration that at highway speeds you will be rapping the engine at 3000rpms+, which doesn't exactly help the mileage.

Transfer Case: The 203, from my knowledge is a good case. Very stout and sturdy. But from what I hear, it does suck the fuel & rob power. Newer, gear-driven, part-time cases are lighter weight and are more efficient than the 203. My 79 K10's 203 was converted into a part timer before I bought it. A part-time conversion may be something to consider since if you get it you live in a warm climate with no snow and likely won't use the 4wd very much. Also, the 203 does not drive the rear wheels off the chain, just the front.

You will also want to check or have a professional check everything over... and I mean everything. All U-joints (shafts & front axles), bearings, seals, gaskets, etc. Granted, they only have 68k miles on them, but because of that, they're probably the originals and are 24+ years old.

You probably and realisitically wouldn't see much more than 10-12 mpg, especially with a non-overdrive transmisison, a 4bbl carb and a full-time 203 case. My dad had a 76 K10 that he bought brand new and it had the 350/4bbl/TH350 trans and a 203 Case and he got 10-12 mpg when the truck was brand new in '76

It sounds like it's in great shape for a truck of that vintage, and as long as you do lots of research before you dive in (like you seem to be doing well) you should be fine.

Good luck and keep us posted.

-Mike

TDS 854X4 · March 12, 2003

There's not much left that I can add here. Between the research and questins you've been asking the owner, and also Mike's response, pretty much everything I can think of has been talked about. These trucks can certainly be driven daily. I did that with my '75, and my '85 for a while. (now I have enough vehicles that none of them are "dailys", unfortunately because at least one of 'em seems to be broken down in some fashion at all times ) I agree with the 10-12 mpg for the full-time setup. My '75 had the same, and I got right around there, not matter if it were in town or freeway miles, it was always around 10...

These trucks are also very simple to work on. Lots of room under the hood far access, very simple mechanicals. I have read of some concern about chain stretch in the T-cases. The chain is a pretty 'beefy' piece, if you've never seen one. Much heavier than a timing chain, I suppose after 100,000+ miles of full-time, there might be a small concern, but I certainly wouldn't let that keep me from the vehicle.

One area I didn't see any mention of is the floorpans. These can rust thru right at your "heels". The lower vents can leak a little, or a leaky windshield seal can let water in, and it tends to puddle right where the floor turns up towards the interior firewall, under the floor matting. Given that so much of the rest of the bodywork has been redone, I would be surprised if this area were overlooked. But just a thought. Don't sweat the carburetor. Figureing that it's the stock quadrajet on there, you may not even need to do anything to it. I have had them on a few different vehicles, only had one that needed a rebuild. Otherwise, I never even touch 'em.

Parts for this vintage of truck are pretty easy to come by as well. Something to think about when you realize that a 20+ year old vehicle is going to be used daily. Things will need replacing. My long bed '85 does not entirely fit in my garage either, haha, but I think if I were willing to clean it out and reorganize, there MIGHT be hope, it would defiinitely be tight though.

I hope that we've helped with some of your concerns. From your description, it sounds like a nice truck.

Colorado Kid · March 14, 2003

$7,000 is a lot for a 24 year old truck in my opinion, but other than that I don't see real red falgs.

Personally I wouldn't bother part-timing the T-case at this point...but even with it part-timed the old K-10s with 350s just never did any better than 13 MPG...and that's when the speed limit was 55 MPH.

An '82 C-10 that my dad owned is still in daily service, and it has a LOT more than 68K miles...it went past that in about '87!

It sounds to me like you are handy enough to keep up with it, and by '79 most of the really troublesome stuff (breaker-points ignition anyone?) had gone bye-bye.

If you keep up the maintenance on it, and like Mike said, worry about the seals, it ought to do just fine as a daily driver.

m1tommy · March 14, 2003

TorqueJunkie, RE your, "...U-joints (shafts & front axles), bearings, seals, gaskets, etc.." All the U-joints and CV-joints were replaced a couple years agoe, now have about 10k on them. The owner says he has a "special needle nose attachment" that fits on a grease gun, to properly lube the CV-joints, that will go w/ the truck. Your link didn't get me wreck photo'd, but a web hosting site. ??? I understand the safety issues. Personally, I preferr mass to design tricks, and I'm a mechanical engineer by training!

TDS 854X4, From this blasted '89 Toyoyo, I know way too much about "things needing replacing" and those Toyoyo parts seem doggoned expen$ive, with nothing very straight forwatd. .... I'll ask the owner about the floorpans, but would be surprised if they didn't shine like the uinderside of the hood and cab roof interior.

Colorado Kid, Yeah, I'm the optimist. I'd have to keep my foor out of the carb, I know.. probably need to more, anyways!

If'n I can get wifey's buy off, I'l need to start looking for a mechanic near the truck. Did I mention it's 1,500 miles off? I'm hoping that I can work transportation into the deal if it goes. I'm pretty sure I heard the Toyoyo's stearing pump making a new noise this morning.....

Speaking of seals; A fellow on another forum mentioned that, on NP203's the seal between the transmission and transfer case may be prone to harden and leak transmision fluid in to the transfer case. As the NP203 is meant to run in 30W, this can be a real GOTCHA. Does anyone hear know about this?

THNAKS for all the great replies! Anything else pertinent (or even sort of pertinient) is apprecated.

Tommy

Torque Junkie · March 15, 2003

Sorry about that... try the link again. http://www.redlineenterprises.com/crash

I haven't heard anything about the seal on the tranny/case leaking, but that doesn't mean much ;)

Sounds like a pretty solid truck though.

Keep us posted!!

-Mike

TDS 854X4 · March 18, 2003

I have never heard of that with regards to the tranny/transfer case, but I only had the NP203 in my old Burb, and I never really gave that truck much effort in maintaining, it was kind of a basket case when I got it. Other forums I've been at, I've never heard mention of that problem though. Not saying it couldn't be an issue. I still don't think that little thing would worry me enough to drop the purchase.

Good luck! Might not be a bad deal to get someone local to give it the "once-over", but it sure does sound decent from everything you've said.

m1tommy · March 19, 2003

TDS 854X4, Thanks for the reply. Yep, being that the truck is 3 days drive away, I'd have to hook up w/ a mechanic to go through it first. Honestly, I might be waivering..... thinking if I really want an old warhorse of a truck... almost said "need"!

There's this '98 Astro that caught my eye... it's sort of almost a truck.... on an S-10 chassis anyways!

We'll see; I'm in no hurry.

The link below should point y'all to some photo's sent to me by the owner. I just picked a few out of about 50.

Holler back if the link don't work. Posting photo's can boggle me sometimes.

Tommy

http://photos.yahoo.com/bc....hoo.com

TDS 854X4 · March 20, 2003

Oh geeez, did you say ASTRO?!?!?!?!

Personally, I have not had great experience with those. But my opinion is only based on trying to help a friend diagnose a problem he was having get his started. Access to anything under the "HOOD?!?!?!" is a royal pain. I truly liked the interior and all, but to me it was definitely not "wrench-friendly" Anyway, he had the front torsion bar ass'y. replaced twice, it broke and couldn't hold the van's nose up anymore. Although I haven't heard of that anywhere else.

Well, good luck with whatever you choose!

Colorado Kid · March 20, 2003

Pretty Truck!

Now I know why it was resprayed...had a '78 C2500 that color myself, and the factory paint went south by 1988.

That '78 was 350, 4bbl, TH-350 (I think, I spose it could have been a TH-400, never gave a lick of trouble so I never bothered to figure it out) and 10.5" full floater rear with 4.56 gears. It never, ever got even 11 MPG. Running solo on cruise at 65 MPH it got 10.0 MPG, running one of the two 20 gallon tanks dry every 3 hours/200 miles like clockwork...did this all the way to south Florida and back.

It was easy to work on, comfortable and dead reliable, but I sold it (with 185,000 miles on it) during the (first) gulf war because I was looking for work and wanted to be able to look in towns 50 miles away without burning 50 gallons a week.

Just keep in mind while you are shopping that fuel to drive it from where it is to where you are will be at least $200.

Astro!!!! This would be the opposite of "easy to work on, comfortable and dead reliable" Try instead: impossible to work on, over weight and under-suspended, cramped (for any driver or front seat passenger actually having two non-detachable legs) and failure prone. Trust me, I've been around some Astros (we call them "Atros" as in "Atrocities") out of maybe 10 of them I think one was actually a pretty decent vehicle...it was a 2WD short-bodied version from very early in the long run of Astros. It's unfortunate that it was good, becuase it blazed the trail for all the "Atros" that followed.

m1tommy · March 20, 2003

CO Kid, I'm about convinced the truck is solid, as far as reliability and maintainability goes. The diff. in that one and a new truck or most anything else I'd consider would buy a lot of gas! Wow, those are some gears in yours!

There's actually quite a group of loyal Astro fans about... surprised me. And, a whole bunch of companies use them for work vehicles. Below's a link to some photo's of the '98 Astro.; most are interior shots, as that's what I asked him for.

Thanks for the reply.

Tommy

http://photos.yahoo.com/bc....hoo.com

m1tommy · March 21, 2003

The truck sold... but not to me.... Oh sell.. thanks for all the replies.. I'll keep looking!

Tommy

Bowtie_Beast · June 25, 2003

I saw a '79 Chevy Stepside on my way to work, so I stopped to look at it. It's in ok shape. Not sure how it runs, but looks like a fairly easy fixer-upper. Too bad I'm broke and not much of a mechanic . Ha,ha...