Towing with the 5.3 V8

Jon A · March 18, 2014

Just because Uncle Joe's always done it that way doesn't make it right, or safe. Besides, if you're speaking of "farm and ranch country" pulling equine and grass rolls you'll probably also notice quite a few 5th wheels and goose necks. Which are WD hitches.

Actually, when an entire community of people who do something for a living, and have for generations, do it a certain way the chances are pretty good they are doing it right. What works and what doesn’t is no mystery when you do something every day.

Driving through a ditch with a WD hitch is definitely not doing it right. The better horse trailers usually have a heavy steel bumper in the rear—not to protect from getting rear-ended, but so you don’t rip it off when you scrape it on the ground. A horse trailer doesn’t do you much good if you can’t get it to where the horses live. I know farm and ranch land in some areas of the country is pretty flat, but not where I’m from. Most WD hitches cause way more problems than they solve over rough terrain.

Yes, goosenecks (which are completely different than WD bumper-pull hitches which is what is being talked about here) are very popular with the heaviest loads, but conventional trailers still get much use for lighter-medium weight loads. The goosenecks are typically quite a bit larger and preclude the bed from being used for much so often it’s much more practical to use a standard trailer unless you’ll be carrying a lot.

And the article is technically incorrect in its statement that "every full-sized pickup sold today is required...to use a (WD hitch) to tow trailers weighing above a certain weight" since you've clearly pointed out the exception to that rule.

I'd call all GM HD's a pretty big exception. I haven't checked any owners' manuals for Ford and Dodge, but if they actually say a 3500 needs a WD hitch to tow 6000 lbs they'd go straight into the garbage.

Slight inaccuries our outdated info aside, I for one am glad that articles such as this are out there to raise awareness. The target audience here isn't the farmer pulling a few cattle w/ the goose neck behind the 3500 (which probably doesn't have brakes...another topic maybe). It's the weekend warrior who will spend 80K on a 10,000lb boat but doesn't want to spend 80K on a truck to pull it safely....

Don't get me wrong, I agree with the sentiment. I'm all for raising awareness and encouraging people to become informed so they do things properly. It's just that that article seemed to have sort of a "guilt-trippish" tone to me. If you're going to lay a guilt trip on people for "endangering the public" and talk about how they can be sued, I think they should be a bit more careful about it--mainly by having more accurate and realistic information from which to base the accusations.

music · March 19, 2014

Somewhat agree, just don't want it to void warranty, i heard in some States it is illegal to go over rating, and people sue for anything.....

Understood... just trying to throw a little water on the internet hyperbole regarding "I heard that..." and "people will sue". The problem is, that the type of lawyer that leaves a slimy streak in the their trail will take suit for just about anything. "You were towing a jet ski with a F350? Did you have that trailer inspected by the State? Did you inspect the hitch before leaving? That's such a big truck, could you even see the trailer behind you? If you couldn't, then you were negligent.". They can come up with anything, but one thing they can't do is get qualified engineers to line up behind them saying that having a 3.08 gear vs a 3.42 somehow caused the trailer to swerve and take out a pedestrian. If I lived in fear of those guys, then I could never drive... and would think twice about riding a bicycle on the road ("you caused two people to die when they suddenly saw you in the bike lane, and swerved to miss you"). Never mind that they were texting/driving in the bike lane.

The real point I'm making is that there is no way that a 3.42 geared truck is "safer" with 7k lbs behind it than one geared at 3.08, all else equal. One may last longer, and may go faster up a 6% grade, but it isn't more dangerous to others (i.e., they present equal opportunity for liable). A good example of something that never gets "rated" is trailer weight balance. A poorly balanced trailer can throw a HD truck off the road well below it's "tow rating", but a tongue-heavy trailer will track true behind just about anything. There is no "law" or manufacturer rating for load balance, as critical as it is. It is up to *us* to get it right.

I guess it's clear that this is a sore point with me, as I look at the engineering aspects before "he said she said"... but I'm really just trying to stick to "reason". Don't take this to mean that I do as I please. I haul our camper with my entire family on board, and take it as serious as that implies it should.

Sorry for the long post... I try not to do that.

Edited March 19, 2014 by music

redwngr · March 19, 2014

Music, I agree with most of what you are saying.

The owners manual does give recommendation (requirement? rating?) for load balancing. The have specific wording regarding the % of trailer load that needs to be on the tongue AND the also are careful to warn the as well as not exceeding the GCWR of the truck/trailer combination that it is also necessary to not exceed the weight rating of the hitch.

Those that pull trailers need to be sure they meet these requirements.

bdbake01 · March 19, 2014

Actually, when an entire community of people who do something for a living, and have for generations, do it a certain way the chances are pretty good they are doing it right. What works and what doesn’t is no mystery when you do something every day.

We really aren't getting anywhere productive with this discussion. However, I must respectfully disagree. An entire community "do(ing) something for a living, and have for generations" can often times become overly confident in their own abilities and begin shutting out new ideas. Especially if they came from "somebody who doesn't know what they are doing", which makes for an immediate challenge to one's knowledge and/or abilities. Human nature I guess, nobody likes to be wrong. But there's a BIG difference between "wrong", and learning a new way to do something. Again, this isn't always the case, but sadly it is all too often. Here's the trick the way I see it. If the answer is "it's always worked this way", and you know, for CERTAIN, why that method has been successful, AND those same set of circumstances still exist...then you are justified in your position. If, by chance, the circumstances have changed or the reason why said method has been successful in the past is no longer valid, well it's time to learn a new trick.

For reference I grew up on a farm. So did my father. And his father. And his father before that...you get the idea. Also, ALL of my aunts/uncles/and nearly all of my cousins. Which, is a lot. We were a breeding bunch. Milking cows by the time I was ten, I've seen more hay, tobacco, peppers, corn, beans, etc. than I ever wish to see again. Raised and showed Tennessee Walking horses. As well as our fair share of mules and other work breeds. Pigs, goats, sheep, all form of yard bird, you name it my family has and does have it. I had quite the challenge in getting my driver's license as the fields I had been driving in since I was heavy enough to push the clutch down didn't have these things called "lanes" that you had to stay in LOL!

Driving through a ditch with a WD hitch is definitely not doing it right. The better horse trailers usually have a heavy steel bumper in the rear—not to protect from getting rear-ended, but so you don’t rip it off when you scrape it on the ground. A horse trailer doesn’t do you much good if you can’t get it to where the horses live. I know farm and ranch land in some areas of the country is pretty flat, but not where I’m from. Most WD hitches cause way more problems than they solve over rough terrain.

I've never had an issue with traversing a ditch w/ a WD hitch. I'd rather have it there keeping the rear of the truck up instead of letting it sag and then rip my truck's bumper off. And then getting stuck and having to get my buddy to drag me out with his Dodge. On a side note, I don't know why it is but it seems like every time I've been stuck somewhere, I end up getting pulled out by a Dodge piloted by a friend who enjoys gloating. Oh well.

All of my trailers have either rollers or slides so they don't drag. Dragging the rear end of the trailer SUCKS not only because it's hard on the trailer & rig, but it makes it MUCH harder to pull as you're now pulling the trailer and plowing the field at the same time. Weld on a small slide, done. As for hills and valleys, I'm from KY. We know hollers & hills.

Never had much use for a horse I had to go TO. If he doesn't get in the truck when I tell him to, I did a poor job of breaking him. I might have to chase him down...once.

Yes, goosenecks (which are completely different than WD bumper-pull hitches which is what is being talked about here) are very popular with the heaviest loads, but conventional trailers still get much use for lighter-medium weight loads. The goosenecks are typically quite a bit larger and preclude the bed from being used for much so often it’s much more practical to use a standard trailer unless you’ll be carrying a lot.

I'd call all GM HD's a pretty big exception. I haven't checked any owners' manuals for Ford and Dodge, but if they actually say a 3500 needs a WD hitch to tow 6000 lbs they'd go straight into the garbage.

Don't get me wrong, I agree with the sentiment. I'm all for raising awareness and encouraging people to become informed so they do things properly. It's just that that article seemed to have sort of a "guilt-trippish" tone to me. If you're going to lay a guilt trip on people for "endangering the public" and talk about how they can be sued, I think they should be a bit more careful about it--mainly by having more accurate and realistic information from which to base the accusations.

Goosenecks and 5th wheels are a TYPE of WD hitch. As in, they distribute the weight. But yes, completely different critters. A gooseneck ball doesn't take up much room, but I've tripped over them more times than I care to think about. Yeah, the article was stiff w/ the guilt trip, but some people need to be jogged a bit for it to soak in.

EXSlider400 · March 19, 2014

Maybe it is me??? Does anyone else know what I am asking because GMC has no clue!!! Read the email they sent and my response on top. If it's 6,600 and it is a misprint that would mean according to the owners manual, same truck with v6 tows more than a v8 & 3.08?? Makes no sense. I am ready to just say screw it and give up.

Edited March 19, 2014 by EXSlider400

bdbake01 · March 19, 2014

It's not just you dude, you clearly have conflicting information there.

redwngr · March 19, 2014

Lets see.

OM says that for 1500 crew - short box - 4wd:

V6 3.42 pulls 6700lb

V8 3.42 pulls 96001b (5.3L on next page from one posted above)

so a V8 rated more than a v6 when similarly equipped. (as expected)

But V8 with 3.08 pulls only 8600 in manual, so 3.42 out pulls 3.08. (as expected)

The owners manual seems consistent with these and other cab/box/rearend/engine/2wd-4wd versions.

However,

The ordering guide agrees with the gm response and disagrees with the owners manual.

Ordering guide shows TK15543 (4wd, 1500, crew, short (5'8") box, 3.08, 5.3L at 6600lb trailer maximum.

At the 3.42 ratio, ordering guide is 9600 and OM is 9600, so they are same for that configuration.

You can check your codes in the glovebox sticker. 3.08 is GU4 and 3.42 is GU6 is 3.42.

EXSlider400 · March 19, 2014

My rpo is GU4. That was 1st thing I did was print out an rpo sheet and highlight all the ones I had. Good info.

redwngr · March 19, 2014

3.42's and you'd be golden.

Or just accept the OM instead of the trailering specs in the ordering guide.

Jon A · March 20, 2014

I've never had an issue with traversing a ditch w/ a WD hitch. I'd rather have it there keeping the rear of the truck up instead of letting it sag and then rip my truck's bumper off.

I don't think we're talking about the same sort of ditch. I didn't say over a ditch, I said through. As in the truck drives down one side while the trailer is still on level ground creating a large angle between the two. When the trailer is going down the first side the truck is driving up the other side, creating an extreme angle. When the trailer is coming up the far bank the truck is already on level ground.

A sagging rear is the least of your worries--binding stuff up, scraping the WD hitch on the ground, bending or breaking something is what you need to be worried about. There is a time and place for them--this isn't it.

Never had much use for a horse I had to go TO. If he doesn't get in the truck when I tell him to, I did a poor job of breaking him. I might have to chase him down...once.

If yours carry cell phones and have grown opposable thumbs with which to open gates, that's great but ours don't--we still need to get to the range they're on. If there were nicely manicured gravel roads to each location that would be one thing, but the reality is crossing fields, ditches, coulees, etc, is the norm.

I've tried for many years to train the round bales to come when I call, but never had much luck.

But there's a BIG difference between "wrong", and learning a new way to do something. Again, this isn't always the case, but sadly it is all too often. Here's the trick the way I see it. If the answer is "it's always worked this way", and you know, for CERTAIN, why that method has been successful, AND those same set of circumstances still exist...then you are justified in your position. .

The problem is, you need to be able to show some rancher that he will somehow benefit from screwing with a WD hitch that'll scrape on the ground half the places he goes every time he hooks a medium weight trailer to the back of his 3/4 ton. You can't because there isn't any. Lots of time, lots of PITA, lots of potential problems. No benefit. That's why nobody does it.

Transporting an extremely heavy load of something with a bumper pull over a long highway distance? That's a different story. There it would certainly be appropriate. Of course there he'd just tell you that's what the gooseneck is for.

EXSlider400 · March 20, 2014

Customer service rep verified the manual that came with my truck was incorrect and it was changed to 6600 (100 less then v6) here is the link for the new manual

https://my.gmc.com/web/portal/knowmyvehicle?g=1&year=2014&model=1500_sierra&make=gmc

The other link in previous post, although currently on gmc site, is not correct.

Edited March 20, 2014 by EXSlider400

EXSlider400 · March 20, 2014

Here is. pic. I wonder if gmc will change gears up since the information of my owners manual is incorrect, may cause damage, and therefore unsafe.

redwngr · March 20, 2014

Depends what they told you before you bought it.

I went a dug up a 14 sierra brochure and it has the lower value listed for CC SB 4wd 5.3L.

fondupot · March 20, 2014

I'm gonna check my OM in my truck to see what it says. I was using a digital copy i Had on my computer that shows 8600 for the 3.08. Just replaced it with the new one post.