Small Diesel For 1/2 Tons

[Daryl Z71]

The more emmission garbage the EPA wants them to install the more expensive they get, and the more likely they won't even bother making one. Look at what CAT did with their engines. They decided to stop putting them in the Tractor Trailers.

That's most likely due to the amount of off road equipment that they make that will keep them in

business. You won't see Cummins or Detroit Diesel doing that, I'm sure.

 

 

 

 

I disagree:

 

 

 

Cat to exit highway engines, build truck with Navistar

By Todd Dills

 

Caterpillar will not produce an engine for North American on-highway truck makers that will meet stricter 2010 emissions standards, said George Taylor, company director for global on-highway products.

 

Caterpillar also announced June 12, with Navistar, that the companies will produce a Caterpillar-branded severe-service vocational truck.

 

Those moves are the leading edge of a strategic partnership between the companies on global initiatives in diesel engine technology, Taylor and others said in a conference call with the news media.

 

“The writing’s on the wall for independent engine suppliers,” Taylor said, citing current on-highway engine market over-saturation amid tightening demand. “It will be increasingly difficult to participate in the North American market as an independent engine supplier.”

The new Cat-branded truck will be designed for construction, logging and other applications, Taylor said. It will be introduced in the “2010 timeframe” and feature “a Caterpillar-branded engine produced by Navistar.”

 

The partnership, established through a non-binding “memorandum of understanding,” represents a “cooperation on developing technology,” said Mark Stasell, Navistar vice president and general manager for diversified operations.

 

Caterpillar will move forward with Navistar to “capitalize on the global market” in medium- and heavy-duty trucks, leveraging its global distribution network for construction vehicles and Navistar’s sophisticated truck manufacturing capabilities to send both brands far into the global truck market, Taylor said.

 

Lack of a Cat-branded on-highway engine compliant with the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency’s 2010 emissions standards would be no hindrance to this strategy, said Greg Gauger, Caterpillar’s global on-highway product manager. “The ability to build and distribute trucks globally with EPA ‘07 and earlier engines ... can go on for quite some time” in countries not subject to U.S. and European emissions standards, he said.

 

Navistar plans to meet the 2010 standards with its new MaxxForce engine line. A new plant in Huntsville, Ala., will produce the on-highway big-bore variants of the MaxxForce line of heavy- and medium-duty engines. Further expansion of capabilities elsewhere could be expected for both companies, representatives said.

 

In the long term, both companies remained committed to meeting emissions regulations by utilizing technologies other than selective catalytic reduction, which involves the introduction of urea.

 

Caterpillar officials said dealerships will provide service for the life of the equipment on Cat on-highway engines, which in recent years have incorporated proprietary ACERT emissions control technology. Caterpillar will continue to supply '07-compliant engines through 2009.

 

Caterpillar’s on-highway business has not kept up with its expanding overall engine market.

 

“In the past 15 years, Cat has become significantly less dependent on the sale of on-highway truck engines in the total contribution of our global engine profitability,” said Douglas Oberhelman, Caterpillar group president. “Our global power systems business has grown significantly. In fact, we supply approximately 400,000 diesel engines annually outside of the on-highway truck market. We intend to remain the world leader in clean diesel engines, and this collaboration is a key enabler.”

 

 

 

 

http://www.etrucker.com/apps/news/article....e_weekly_update

[jro909]

its a wet dream....i'd love to see diesel go mainstream but with the tree huggers choking us all out with emissions crap that dream is fadeing...diesel is the answer to america's fuel problems...you can make diesel out of almost anything

[mike94silverado]

your average 1/2 Ton buyer won't pay for the Diesel upgrade, and won't do the required maintenance. the enthusiests want it but we are really a small portion of buyers on the whole.

[05GMCZ71]

As has been previously stated, the enviro nazi's/tree huggers and politicians (certain ones) don't believe that Diesel is all that effective, which is totally wrong. It's really a shame. Awesome technology, power, and reliability has already been proven in Europe and other countries from diesels, yet America continues to lag behind.

[bwlaqua]

diesel is a hell of a lot better than gas. i just cant afford to get the bigger truck for the diesel engine. If they brought out the 4.5 and put it in the lightduty trucks i would deff get it.

[Cool Zr2]

Th reason Cat stopped producing Over The Road Engines is because the EPA Mandated By 2012 Evey over the road truck produced would have to meet thier regulations without Uria. Cat was the only one of the big 4(Cat, Cummins,International,Volvo) Who designed a system to comply without Uria. International complained soo bad that it couldnt be done, that the EPA then Allowed the use of Uria to comply with the 2012 Regulations. Cat got pissed and pulled the plug on Over The Road Engines and said F*** The EPA, No Need for emissions on Equipment!

The more emmission garbage the EPA wants them to install the more expensive they get, and the more likely they won't even bother making one. Look at what CAT did with their engines. They decided to stop putting them in the Tractor Trailers.

That's most likely due to the amount of off road equipment that they make that will keep them in

business. You won't see Cummins or Detroit Diesel doing that, I'm sure.

 

 

 

NAVSTAR does not use urea in it's maxforce engines. They can meet emissions without it.

[Cloudsplitter]

your average 1/2 Ton buyer won't pay for the Diesel upgrade, and won't do the required maintenance. the enthusiests want it but we are really a small portion of buyers on the whole.

 

+1 Mike, this is probably the BEST explanation on why you won't see a diesel option in the 1500 trucks.

 

Many of the other comments posted before are contributing factors. Yes, uneducated people have labeled diesel as 'evil', we can't get past the morons at the EPA and CARB, etc.

 

Just to add my two cents, I think GM also considers that a diesel 1500 option would take away from sales of 2500 HD trucks. They are having a hard enough time moving those $45K trucks in California as it is.

 

Someone said above that 1500 diesel wouldn't make sense, to that I disagree... a 4.5 diesel would have similar HP to my 5.4 gas, but it'll have a helluva lot more torque, and thats what I need. Plus, the 1500 body and frame is maybe 1400 pounds lighter than a 2500.

 

Bottom line, GM is gonna keep making a 1500 truck platform that appeals to the AVERAGE buyer (so they can sell more!), and that happens to be GAS...

[sledtrash]

http://www.dieselpow...el/viewall.html

 

 

Right before the economy crashed.... when the government bailed GM out they definately put a stop to it. I see it happening eventually they are just developing and biding their time until the economy is right. This means that the technology will be way better and the engine could get better than the 28 estimated at the time.... I wish I could find the magazine article that I originally read about this engine in. It had a lot of infor on MPG and wasn't just a question and answer article. I had the magazine now I don't....

 

http://www.autoinsane.com/2009/03/11/news/business-finance/gms-light-duty-45l-duramax-diesel-on-indefinite-hold/

[TheTrueMoron]

http://www.dieselpow...el/viewall.html

 

 

Right before the economy crashed.... when the government bailed GM out they definately put a stop to it. I see it happening eventually they are just developing and biding their time until the economy is right. This means that the technology will be way better and the engine could get better than the 28 estimated at the time.... I wish I could find the magazine article that I originally read about this engine in. It had a lot of infor on MPG and wasn't just a question and answer article. I had the magazine now I don't....

 

http://www.autoinsan...ndefinite-hold/

 

 

There is the Cummins diesel engine that's currently being experimented with in the Titan...

 

http://www.gm-trucks.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=135235&hl=diesel&fromsearch=1

[neto1978]

Doubt it will happen. Diesels are like a $5k+ option on the HD trucks and that's a tough pill to swallow for half tons where most aren't constantly hauling or towing.

 

 

I had 4 silverados in my life , the first was a 1995 turbo diesel C1500 ext cab 4x2, I promissed myself not to buy any diesels anymore, the 3 after all have been flexfuels, diesels are too complex engines, a whole lot of more parts to break, I love the gas engines ,so simple! in some countries where diesel is half the price of gas, it would be good, but not in the USA!!!

[Lt CHEG]

Frankly, I'd love to see the proposed 4.5 DMax as an option even in the 2500HD's. If I can get engine performance equivalent to the 6.0 Vortec, or at least close to it, with 20+ mpg combined city and highway mileage, I'd be all over it. I need a 3/4 ton to handle the tongue weight of my trailer, I really don't care if I have to slow down a bit going up hill. People were towing 12,000 and 13,000 pound trailers for many years with big blocks and diesels which put out 25% less power than even the 5.3 liter V8 is putting out nowadays. Some people need the extra beefiness of an HD truck for some applications but don't need the ultra power of the 6.6L DMax. I think if GM could get the engine to meet EPA standards cost effectively enough and was willing to market the engine in the 1500 and HD series of Silverados, then it could be a profitable venture.

 

The other thing somewhat in the favor of smaller diesels is that European standards will soon be as strict as EPA standards. Auto companies can afford to ignore the US marketplace for diesels, but they can't afford to ignore the US AND Europe, so pretty soon we should be able to see some of the European diesels over here. The automakers will just have to get better at making the engines meet tighter emissions standards for less money so they can still meet demand in Europe. I think a good sign that they may be seeing the light is the release that the new Colorado/Canyon trucks will be coming stateside. In the European market the truck will only be available with a diesel engine. Maybe that means that a diesel will make its way to the US as well.

[arz71]

Gm was geared up for it in NY. They had some of the assembly line finished in Tonowanda (doubt its spelled right) My cousin set his portion up. Then they scapped it. I'm sure its in china along with all out scrap now. What a bummer.

 

 

I agree, CHINA probably now owns the rights and is going to make them and sell them back to us at 10 times the asking price with CHINESE durability (sarcasm included). The EPA has done more damage to the USA than all of the Al Gores combined.

[rah7777777]

I'd love a nice 6 cylinder diesel in my 1500.

I used to have a VW Jetta diesel and I loved that car. loved the motor.

I love diesel power! Although, I live too close to work for a diesel now, poor thing would never heat up like it needs.

[chakis24]

no. from what ive read the design was pretty much complete but it lost money the entire way....and with the new epa regulations they decided to cut their losses and run.

[kstruckcountry]

It wouldn't take much for it to happen. But it won't, because of the gov't. Cost for buyers wouldn't be an issue, it isn't overseas (in cars) and wouldn't be here. If somebody wants a diesel, they have the option to get it in a lighter truck, which I would be attracted to. They don't take any more maintenance than a gas engine does anymore. And the "average buyer" gets the stealership to do it for them anyways.

 

I'd love to have a diesel, but I don't want to fill up urea. Basically the gov't is killing the diesels. The mileage on my buddy's 5.9 12-valver is around 20 mpg, that's with his huge tires (dually as well) on a truck with 200k + miles. Imagine how well the new trucks would run without all the emissions crap... apparently someone did, hence the delete kits...